<I>

  <&>Wellington Corpus of Spoken New Zealand English Version One</&>
  <&>Copyright 1998 School of Linguistics & Applied Language Studies</&>
  <&>Victoria University of Wellington</&>

  <&>tape one side two</&>
  <&>0:56</&>
  

  <WSC#DGU006:0005:KB>
      bill dillon

  <WSC#DGU006:0010:BD>
      mister speaker in the general debate of this afternoon we have
      had a number of issues raised by the opposition

  <WSC#DGU006:0015:BD>
      er some of them have dealt with the major issue that has been
      raised by the government and that is the question of the clyde
      dam

  <WSC#DGU006:0020:BD>
      and it is proposed that this be <,> this be this be summed up er
      at this stage <,>

  <WSC#DGU006:0025:BD>
      here we have the latest three hundred and thirty seven MILlion
      stabilisation bill for clyde <,>

  <WSC#DGU006:0030:BD>
      this being but the most recent in a saga of blunders and
      disasters associated with this project

  <WSC#DGU006:0035:BD>
      mister speaker it could probably be significantly termed the
      maramarua memorial

  <WSC#DGU006:0040:BD>
      certainly not a memorial hall but it will stand there forever
      more as a <laughs>memorial to the member for maramarua</laughs>
      <,,>

  <WSC#DGU006:0045:BD>
      blackadder's pyramid has been suggested <,>

  <WSC#DGU006:0050:BD>
      blackadder goes <&>2:00</&> forth and brings forth a dam <O>coughs</O>

  <WSC#DGU006:0055:BD>
      Mister speaker the blame for this fiasco <{1><[1><,></[1> rests
      entirely with the national opposition and in particular the
      member for maramarua

  <WSC#DGU006:0060:BD>
      but of course there is equal blame for those who supported those
      who were in government at that time

  <WSC#DGU006:0065:BD>
      primarily that would be for those who were in cabinet <,>

  <WSC#DGU006:0070:BD>
      BUT also extending through to those who were in caucus

  <WSC#DGU006:0075:BD>
      too bad that we didn't have a previous person like the member
      for albany who could have in the face of the proposal tendered
      his resignation <,> <O>coughs</O>

  <WSC#DGU006:0080:BD>
      but what do we have we do have from the member for selwyn a very
      sincere expression of apology <&>3:02</&> an expression of
      regret er for having er supported the proposal at that time

  <WSC#DGU006:0085:BD>
      it might well be significant mister speaker if also the member
      for raglan er were reminded of what HE had to say concerning er
      the clyde dam <,>

  <WSC#DGU006:0090:BD>
      <.>a</.> and i quote from some of those <,> some of those
      reports <.>b</.> at that time in june and er in nineteen eighty
      two <,> where the member for raglan said the public have a right
      to be sceptical about the government's support for the clyde
      high dam <,>

  <WSC#DGU006:0095:BD>
      how true <,>

  <WSC#DGU006:0100:BD>
      much of the information was both compelling and disturbing

  <WSC#DGU006:0105:BD>
      to commit a workforce and capital to the project when it knew
      that shows a cynical disregard for the rule of law

  <WSC#DGU006:0110:BD>
      now those are <&>4:00</&> quotations from the member for raglan
      in june nineteen eighty two

  <WSC#DGU006:0115:BD>
      at a time when the THEN government was committed er to the clyde
      high dam proposal er but when in fact it had not made the vast
      investments of money that are <&>drawl</&> now a memorial to the
      member for maramarua <,>

  <WSC#DGU006:0120:BD>
      mister speaker taxpayers are still paying er for <&>drawl</&>
      the member for maramarua's pet projects <,,>

  <WSC#DGU006:0125:BD>
      besides the clyde dam there are all the other think big schemes
      which he so proudly touted around the country at that time but
      which now are approaching a monstrous figure of nine point five
      BILlion DOLlars <,>

  <WSC#DGU006:0130:BD>
      this three hundred and thirty seven added to the previous nine
      billion takes it towards takes it towards the nine point five
      <&>5:02</&> BILlion figure <,>

  <WSC#DGU006:0135:BD>
      but <,> let's be fair

  <WSC#DGU006:0140:BD>
      the member for maramarua is not the only member who should hang
      his head in shame <,,>

  <WSC#DGU006:0145:BD>
      once again this government is left to clean up another mess left
      to it <,> by the opposition <,>

  <WSC#DGU006:0150:BD>
      as usual they will take no blame

  <WSC#DGU006:0155:BD>
      it will all be someone else's fault

  <WSC#DGU006:0160:BD>
      if the opposition cannot take responsibility for their past
      actions what hope is there that they will take responsibility
      for their actions in the future

  <WSC#DGU006:0165:BD>
      mister speaker the members in the opposition benches are tainted
      with the clyde dam fiasco

  <WSC#DGU006:0170:BD>
      this debate is proof that national are unfit to govern new
      zealand

  <WSC#DGU006:0175:BD>
      their caucus is FULL of former ministers who rejected that sound
      advice given to them who displayed contempt for the due process
      of law <&>6:00</&> who refused to heed public opinion <,> and
      who wasted millions of dollars <,> of the taxpayers' money <,>

  <WSC#DGU006:0180:BD>
      today these same people are trying to tell us they can form the
      next government of this country

  <WSC#DGU006:0185:BD>
      mister speaker in reality they CANnot be trusted <,>

  <WSC#DGU006:0190:BD>
      mister speaker <,,>

  <WSC#DGU006:0195:BD>
      let's just have a look at some of the headlines that have been
      in the newspaper in the media er since this revelation er has
      been er publicised in the last few days and weeks

  <WSC#DGU006:0200:BD>
      <reads>muldoon defends clyde dam decision</reads>

  <WSC#DGU006:0205:BD>
      the member for tamaki still retains that this was a sound
      decision

  <WSC#DGU006:0210:BD>
      he argues that the clyde dam was built with the <reads>support
      of the best <&>7:00</&> professional advice</reads>

  <WSC#DGU006:0215:BD>
      the headline suggesting that there was a public danger that
      there was official secrecy and the clyde dam still came through
      as publicised <&>pronounced as publishised</&> by the national
      business review

  <WSC#DGU006:0220:BD>
      all of this refutes muldoon's the claim <.>fro</.> the member
      for <{2><[2>tamaki</[2>

  <WSC#DGU006:0225:KB>
      <[1>order</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGU006:0230:KB>
      <[2>order</[2></{2> yeah i think the <,> the the member must
      refer <,,><&>6</&> <{><[><,>

  <WSC#DGU006:0235:KB>
      no the not not the member</[>

  <WSC#DGU006:0240:BD>
      <[>er

  <WSC#DGU006:0245:BD>
      mister speaker is</[></{> that an interjection from the member
      <{1><[1>who wished who wished</[1> that the dead person <{2><[2>on
      mount maunganui</[2>

  <WSC#DGU006:0250:KB>
      <[1>order order</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGU006:0255:KB>
      <[2><drawls>order</drawls></[2></{2> order if the member resumes
      his seat

  <WSC#DGU006:0260:KB>
      no the the member <,>

  <WSC#DGU006:0265:KB>
      order <,>

  <WSC#DGU006:0270:KB>
      the the member er in referring to a member of the house used his
      er his his <{><[>er surname</[>

  <WSC#DGU006:0275:BD>
      <[>and immediately</[></{> immediately <{><[>corrected sir</[>

  <WSC#DGU006:0280:KB>
      <[>and the member</[></{> the member <,>

  <WSC#DGU006:0285:KB>
      we have <.>we</.> <.>a</.> approved in this house the reference
      to to the muldoon government and to er to er rogernomics for
      example <&>8:06</&> <&>tape cuts out then continues on second
      tape</&> <&>tape two side one</&> <&>0:29</&>

  <WSC#DGU006:0290:KB>
      we can use people's names for those when they become part of a a
      a muldoonist approach i think <.>t</.> is is is acceptable but
      but not not <.>j</.> not in the terms which the member used <{><[><unclear>word</unclear></[>

  <WSC#DGU006:0295:BD>
      <[>yes</[></{> mister speaker i immediately corrected by calling
      him <.>th</.> the member for tamaki <,,><&>3</&>

  <WSC#DGU006:0300:KB>
      <{><[>bill dillon</[>

  <WSC#DGU006:0305:BD>
      <[>mister speaker</[></{> <,> do we hear from the member for for
      kaimai the member who had the audacity <&>1:00</&> to write a
      letter to me WISHing that the name of the person killed on mount
      maunganui was monica dillon rather than monica candwell <latch>

  <WSC#DGU006:0310:XX>
      that's absolute rubbish <latch>

  <WSC#DGU006:0315:BD>
      well you just take that back

  <WSC#DGU006:0320:XX>
      <unclear>word</unclear> absolute <{><[>rubbish</[>

  <WSC#DGU006:0325:BD>
      <[>just</[></{> take that <{><[>back</[>

  <WSC#DGU006:0330:XX>
      <[>absolute</[></{> rubbish

  <WSC#DGU006:0335:BD>
      mister speaker <,> mister speaker can i say that <,> the claim
      by the member for tamaki <,>

  <WSC#DGU006:0340:BD>
      the member for tamaki <,> still has his claim that the clyde dam
      decision could be deFENDed refuted by that in the national
      business REview <,> the report which shows that the official
      secrecy and the public danger still required in <&>2:00</&> THAT
      member's mind the clyde dam to proceed

  <WSC#DGU006:0345:BD>
      mister speaker i suggest that <,> the <,> since the last debate
      on the clyde dam fiasco there has come to hand the new
      information which reveals national's incompetence over this
      issue <,>

  <WSC#DGU006:0350:BD>
      today they want <,> to lay this to rest

  <WSC#DGU006:0355:BD>
      they want to debate anything in this general debate except the
      clyde dam

  <WSC#DGU006:0360:BD>
      i believe it is important and significant to this country that
      this dam fiasco the fiasco of the dam be reminded to the people
      of this country to show that those who were in power at that
      time are still those <,> who <,,> favour the treasury benches
      who seek to <&>3:04</&> gain the treasury benches and that new
      zealand needs to be reminded that that sort of fiasco should not
      ever be visited on this country ever again <,>

  <WSC#DGU006:0365:BD>
      mister speaker the cabinet paper that has been revealed this
      week shows it all that despite there being a choice between the
      low dam and the high dam <,> because of the aramoana er power
      scheme er that was <?>bruited</?> but which of course was <,>
      well behind before the work was initially er undertaken it was
      still possible for the government of the day to revert back to
      the low dam after the power smelter the smelter at aramoana er
      had been put to rest

  <WSC#DGU006:0370:BD>
      no it continued on and we now have <{1><[1><,></[1> a further
      obligation <{2><[2>to find</[2> means of <{3><[3>stabilising the
      ground in that area</[3>

  <WSC#DGU006:0375:KB>
      <[1>order</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGU006:0380:KB>
      <[2>order</[2></{2>

  <WSC#DGU006:0385:KB>
      <[3>the honorable member's time</[3></{3> has now expired
      <&>4:08</&> <&>unsourced recording</&> <&>32:43</&>

  <WSC#DGU006:0390:KB>
      yes the right honourable <,> helen clark

  <WSC#DGU006:0395:HC>
      mister chairman <.>it</.> it's really amazing what some members
      of the opposition get into a lather about sir

  <WSC#DGU006:0400:HC>
      a small trust designed to help trade unions bring themselves
      into the modern age sir <loudly>bring themselves into the modern
      age</loudly>

  <WSC#DGU006:0405:HC>
      MEMBERS OF THE OPPOSITION <&>33:00</&> constantly rail against
      trade unions

  <WSC#DGU006:0410:HC>
      they call them outdated oldfashioned ineffective and when
      somebody tries to do something about that they find a conspiracy
      sir and i say they only allege conspiracy because they're too
      dull to actually go through their estimates properly and ask the
      sort of questions which might show them just how well part of
      the taxpayers' money was being spent and seeing sir that unions
      are modern and effective industrial institutions in the nineteen
      nineties sir

  <WSC#DGU006:0415:HC>
      i say the trust is a worthwhile experiment sir

  <WSC#DGU006:0420:HC>
      i say that unions will be able to service their members better
      and that is in the interests of industrial relations in this
      country <&>33:53</&> <&>end of Helen Clark's talk</&>
</I>
