<I>

  <&>Wellington Corpus of Spoken New Zealand English Version One</&>
  <&>Copyright 1998 School of Linguistics & Applied Language Studies</&>
  <&>Victoria University of Wellington</&>

  <&>side one</&>
  <&>0:18</&>
  

  <WSC#DGZ060:0005:AD>
      right <,>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0010:AD>
      like i've said to everybody if we could keep this meeting to
      half an hour i think cos we're <,> we've all got lots of things
      to keep us occupied <,>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0015:AD>
      um jasmine has er given me a few things on the agenda

  <WSC#DGZ060:0020:AD>
      i haven't distributed an agenda <drawls>um</drawls> <,>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0025:AD>
      <.>last</.> unless anybody has any objections i will just choose
      an order which <?>suits</?> go on

  <WSC#DGZ060:0030:AD>
      is that okay

  <WSC#DGZ060:0035:DI>
      <{><[>agreed</[> <O>laughs</O>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0040:JS>
      <[>okay</[></{>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0045:AD>
      okay right um first <,> perhaps start with something
      controversial <O>inhales</O> um and that is now that jasmine has
      officially retired <&>1:00</&> <?>just a minute</?> <&>closes
      the door</&> <,> and her job is vacant and may or may not be
      replaced <O>inhales</O> it might be an idea for us to give
      eileen OUR ideas on <{><[>how</[> r p d should be restructured

  <WSC#DGZ060:0050:JS>
      <[>mm</[></{>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0055:JS>
      not r p d <?>just</?> this section of it anyway <{><[><?>needs</?>
      <unclear>word</unclear></[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0060:AD>
      <[><.>well</.> <.>well</.></[></{> well i mean the <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0065:JS>
      yeah

  <WSC#DGZ060:0070:AD>
      okay but um <.>h</.> but <?>r p d</?> because i mean it affects
      <{><[>what</[> other positions may or may not be <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0075:JS>
      <[>mm</[></{>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0080:JS>
      mm <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0085:AD>
      be created what the people <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0090:JS>
      can <{1><[1>can</[1> i say i i'm delighted

  <WSC#DGZ060:0095:JS>
      i feel like toscanini because when he retired or <.>i</.> he
      might have died

  <WSC#DGZ060:0100:JS>
      <{2><[2>anyway the <{3><[3>orchestra</[2> <unclear>word</unclear>
      <?>no</?> anyway</[3> no <laughs>anyway the orchestra decided
      they couldn't possibly disband and they went on anyway</laughs>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0105:AD>
      <[1>here</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0110:DI>
      <[2><laughs><unclear>word</unclear></laughs></[2></{2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0115:CL>
      <[3>he he did eventually</[3></{3>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0120:DI>
      mm

  <WSC#DGZ060:0125:JS>
      and i really think it's quite important because if we don't do
      something <.>an</.> <.>an</.> and HARD <,> it'll just <,> be
      lost and um <.>i</.> i hope to demonstrate with the tape that
      i've got here that i think it'd be a great SHAME <.>if</.> if
      the <&>2:00</&> <,> SPECIFIC a a <,> function was just sort of
      <,> WAS disappeared not disappeared <.>b</.> but <{><[>you know</[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0130:AD>
      <[><?>made redundant</?></[></{> mm <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0135:DI>
      yeah <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0140:JS>
      the disappeared <{><[>ones <unclear>word</unclear></[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0145:AD>
      <[>mm <,> <.>bu</.></[></{> er er <.>but</.> but <.>tr</.> is
      there um <,> possibility within r p d though for there to be <O>inhales</O>
      more advisers not just <?>audio advice</?>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0150:AD>
      i mean should there be created if they're going to restructure
      <,> at any stage more um more <,> <slowly>thump head</slowly>
      <O>laughs</O> um <.>ad</.> advisers as jasmine was for audio

  <WSC#DGZ060:0155:AD>
      should there be something for um <.>au</.> um <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0160:JS>
      video <{><[>computing</[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0165:AD>
      <[>video yes</[></{>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0170:AD>
      yes <{><[>computing and things like that</[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0175:CL>
      <[>well aren't aren't you the</[></{> the <.>a</.> <.>a</.>
      adviser already

  <WSC#DGZ060:0180:AD>
      mm?

  <WSC#DGZ060:0185:CL>
      i thought you were <{1><[1>the</[1> <{2><[2>audio adviser in so
      far as</[2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0190:AD>
      <[1>oh</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0195:JS>
      <[2><?>yes but</?> <unclear>word</unclear> <?>he'd happy to do
      some</?></[2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0200:AD>
      <[2><O>voc</O> <?><.>i</.> i <.>i</.> <.>i</.></?> <unclear>word</unclear></[2></{2>
      i mean having responsibility cos now that jasmine has retired
      madeleine is <{><[>in charge of everything</[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0205:JS>
      <[><?>she ought to be here my god</?></[></{> <unclear>word</unclear>
      <?>meeting</?> <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0210:AD>
      <?>oh <.>no</.> <.>does</.> doesn't matter</?> no <.>w</.> we'll
      just <.>h</.> have this <{1><[1>among</[1> <laughs>ourselves</laughs>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0215:AD>
      um she gets in charge of EVerything with <drawls>no</drawls> no
      help at <&>3:00</&> all and it seems to me given the complexity
      of all the <,> editing arrangements that <,> um eventually some
      restructuring involving at least <,> one <,> person

  <WSC#DGZ060:0220:AD>
      whether that person should have different

  <WSC#DGZ060:0225:AD>
      needs to be just audio or <{2><[2>be</[2> like a a <?>deputy to</?>
      madeleine with perhaps specific responsibility for audio but
      also <?>helped her with</?> some administration is another
      matter

  <WSC#DGZ060:0230:AD>
      i don't know what anybody else thinks <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0235:JS>
      <[1>okay</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0240:JS>
      <[2>mm</[2></{2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0245:JS>
      mm <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0250:AD>
      i mean is it do we need to present some sort of submissions <{><[>or</[>
      something <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0255:XX>
      <[>well <.>i</.></[></{>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0260:XX>
      <.>can</.> i was going to go back a bit and just sort of um
      think about how this whole er a a group was set <{1><[1>up</[1>
      in the first place and what actually happened was that um there
      was a senior teacher position GENERAL senior teacher in the
      editing <?>group</?> which was then <unclear>word</unclear> <,>
      and <,> that was me <,> and <,> then a second <,> <&>4:00</&>
      senior teacher editing was appointed carmen and after a while i
      sort of shifted sideways so that carmen had the main
      responsibility in the er <{2><[2><unclear>word</unclear></[2>
      editing and with some back up from me <,> but i had the total
      responsibility for setting up a parallel a a group <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0265:JS>
      <[1>mm</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0270:DI>
      <[2><unclear>word</unclear></[2></{2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0275:DI>
      mm <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0280:XX>
      <O>inhales</O> so at that point i mean my job had actually <,>
      it wasn't <O>voc</O> <{1><[1>what i'm</[1> saying is that when i
      was doing it this wasn't my total job

  <WSC#DGZ060:0285:XX>
      i wasn't er supposed to be doing nothing but a a

  <WSC#DGZ060:0290:XX>
      what i was doing was was sort of giving back up to the madeleine
      of the day um but having a a as PART of the job <,> and i'm
      wondering whether that's a possibility whether that there is
      <drawls>a</drawls> <{2><[2>some sort of</[2> a position that
      would maybe combine a a and video <,> and <{3><[3>i don't know
      that</[3>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0295:JS>
      <[1><unclear>word</unclear></[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0300:DI>
      <[2><unclear>word</unclear></[2></{2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0305:JS>
      <[3><?>very different areas</?></[3></{3> aren't they <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0310:XX>
      mm that's <{><[>true</[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0315:JS>
      <[>computing</[></{> is a totally different skill <latch>
      <&>5:00</&>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0320:XX>
      and computing is a <{><[>totally different skill</[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0325:JS>
      <[><unclear>word</unclear> <?>c e</[></{> r c rom or whatever
      <{><[>it gets called</?></[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0330:DI>
      <[>well i'm very</[></{> conscious <?>though</?> i'm very
      conscious that we have a lot of skills in audio

  <WSC#DGZ060:0335:JS>
      mm

  <WSC#DGZ060:0340:DI>
      audio advising broadcasting audio editing um and in producing in
      the audio suite and <,> i felt <.>r</.> really distressed to
      <{1><[1>hear</[1> that there was a possibility of your position
      going but i've been thinking about it further and wonder whether
      <,> um <.>i</.> it should in fact be incorporated in the whole
      audio broadcasting area <{2><[2>more</[2> than it is at the
      moment because which would actually give it more form and more
      skill base <{3><[3>to do the job because um</[3> people that are
      in i almost call it a fourth dimension the ability to <{4><[4>present</[4>
      things in in the audio field in an exciting way and it's almost
      is another way of looking at the world <,> and if you've already
      got people that are involved in broadcasting and audio it seems
      a shame <,> to have a separate audio <&>6:00</&> advisers group
      when there is all this <{5><[5>wealth</[5> in broadcasting
      advising and audio production

  <WSC#DGZ060:0345:JS>
      <[1>mm</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0350:JS>
      <[2><unclear>word</unclear></[2></{2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0355:JS>
      <[3><?>well <.>i</.> uhuh</?> <unclear>word</unclear> <?>just</?></[3></{3>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0360:JS>
      <[4>yes</[4></{4>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0365:JS>
      <[5>mm</[5></{5>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0370:JS>
      well when i wrote my annual <{1><[1>reports</[1> i brought that
      up time and again <,> that i wanted a closer link

  <WSC#DGZ060:0375:JS>
      i thought it would be a good idea never mind that i wanted to
      have a closer link with audio <,> with the audio producers but i
      THINK <,> there's going to be fighting about that because <O>laughs</O>
      divided off the you know r p d that's er planning and
      development section from the production <{2><[2>section</[2> and
      the <,> <drawls>er</drawls> <,>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0380:JS>
      well <.>i</.> i'm in two minds about it

  <WSC#DGZ060:0385:JS>
      i agree with you enTIREly

  <WSC#DGZ060:0390:JS>
      i think the production audios needs to be emphasised more but i
      also think that a as need to be in much much earlier at the
      planning stage

  <WSC#DGZ060:0395:JS>
      i've thinked that for YONKS and nothing's <{3><[3>ever</[3>
      happened <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0400:DI>
      <[1>mm</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0405:AD>
      <[2>yeah</[2></{2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0410:DI>
      <[3>mm</[3></{3>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0415:AD>
      yes <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0420:JS>
      even i'm now i'm jumping on on your agenda but know i <{><[>gave</[>
      you that point <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0425:XX>
      <[>no</[></{>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0430:XX>
      it's also no bad thing provided <.>a</.> any <&>7:00</&>
      advisory group <,> you know sort of a a group can work hand in
      hand with the audio er broadcasting <{><[>side to</[> <.>pr</.>
      you know to produce a united front on some things <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0435:JS>
      <[>mm</[></{>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0440:JS>
      <?>two of us</?> <unclear>word</unclear>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0445:XX>
      <drawls>um</drawls> <,> but do you remember in the early days we
      actually used to have um people from well ted use to come and
      <{1><[1>michael</[1> and so on to the a a <{2><[2>meetings
      sometimes</[2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0450:JS>
      <[1>yes</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0455:JS>
      <[2>well they used to</[2></{2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0460:JS>
      that that went on for a <{><[>long time</[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0465:XX>
      <[>and went <.>in</.></[></{> yeah went on for quite <{><[>a
      long time</[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0470:JS>
      <[>well i thought</[></{> it was an excellent idea and and <{><[><?>so</?></[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0475:XX>
      <[>so</[></{> that so that in fact WE were sort of because i i
      felt if somebody who <,> er was trying to be an audio advisor
      <,> um <,> but wasn't ACtually involved in making broadcasts or
      making tapes any more that i quickly got out of touch
      particularly <{1><[1>about</[1> what was happening in the sort
      of technological area <{2><[2>in</[2> <{3><[3>in</[3> the audio
      suite

  <WSC#DGZ060:0480:JS>
      <[1><?>yes</?></[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0485:JS>
      <[2>mm</[2></{2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0490:AD>
      <[3>mm</[3></{3>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0495:JS>
      <?><.>n</.> now you sorry adam can i can i jump</?> or

  <WSC#DGZ060:0500:AD>
      <O>tut</O> um well i think that's <?>what i'm trying to</?>
      <laughs><?>sort out</?> one thing at a time</laughs> though er
      colin have you got any

  <WSC#DGZ060:0505:CL>
      yeah <.>i</.> i see the key finding from what jasmine
      <&>8:00</&> and di said

  <WSC#DGZ060:0510:CL>
      we're too compartmentalised here <?>as if <{><[>you can</[> sort
      of</?> separate off the functions into neat little <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0515:JS>
      <[>yeah</[></{>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0520:AD>
      <unclear>word</unclear> <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0525:CL>
      <?>just to suit</?> mike thompson's model of of r you know <{><[>r
      p d being</[> different from production really <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0530:DI>
      <[><O>laughs</O></[></{>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0535:DI>
      yes <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0540:AD>
      mm <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0545:CL>
      this isn't it's just not just audio

  <WSC#DGZ060:0550:AD>
      no

  <WSC#DGZ060:0555:CL>
      i think as you say we we should actually be in earlier in the
      planning but so many courses DON'T use tapes <{1><[1>when</[1>
      they could jolly well make better use of tapes and secondly i'm
      disappointed to see how the production of the tapes <?>sometimes</?>
      is so <,> boring and disappointing after the potential you can
      see in it <{2><[2><unclear>word</unclear> <{3><[3><unclear>word</unclear></[2></[3>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0560:JS>
      <[1>yes</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0565:AD>
      <[2>yes yes yeah but <unclear>word</unclear></[2></{2> yes

  <WSC#DGZ060:0570:XX>
      <[3>mm mm exactly yeah</[3></{3>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0575:CL>
      and the third one is that it's coming to that um

  <WSC#DGZ060:0580:AD>
      mm

  <WSC#DGZ060:0585:CL>
      <O>tut</O> c d rom thing <?>i know if you've just sort of</?>
      have heard the first part of it <,> you know and all the <?>visuals
      going on</?> and the audio track that came with it was so POOR

  <WSC#DGZ060:0590:CL>
      the the production was lousy and <{1><[1>what's</[1> the point
      of having all this wonderful thing going on on the screen <{2><[2>when</[2>
      <{3><[3><unclear>word</unclear></[3>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0595:XX>
      <[1>mm</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0600:XX>
      <[2><O>laughs</O></[2></{2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0605:AD>
      <[3><unclear>word</unclear></[3></{3> i i i actually checked i
      went actually saw the maths one this morning <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0610:CL>
      there <.>wa</.> there was this was a very early one it had
      madeleine and <&>9:00</&> caroline's voices on <{1><[1>it</[1>
      and <{2><[2>caroline's voice there was <{3><[3>no projection or</[2>
      anything</[3>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0615:AD>
      <[1>oh</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0620:JS>
      <[2>oh no no no no NO NO</[2></{2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0625:XX>
      <[3>oh that was that was</[3></{3> <{><[>just a pilot</[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0630:JS>
      <[>that was <unclear>word</unclear></[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0635:AD>
      <[><unclear>word</unclear></[></{>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0640:JS>
      <{><[><unclear>word</unclear></[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0645:AD>
      <[>no no no <.>all</.></[></{> all that's been redone <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0650:JS>
      <{><[>yeah</[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0655:CL>
      <[>yeah</[></{>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0660:AD>
      it's been totally redone

  <WSC#DGZ060:0665:CL>
      yes well i'm sure everybody agrees <{><[>that it</[> was a
      disappointment yeah <latch> <&>9:00</&>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0670:AD>
      <[>yeah</[></{>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0675:JS>
      well they didn't have a clue <{><[>but</[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0680:XX>
      <[>yes</[></{> and i think caroline was the first person to say
      had i been making this for any real purpose i wouldn't have
      chosen myself to do it at <{1><[1>all</[1> <,>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0685:XX>
      that was the one <{2><[2>they</[2> did when they were over in
      <{3><[3>australia</[3> <{4><[4>wasn't it</[4>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0690:AD>
      <[1>mm</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0695:AD>
      <[2>mm</[2></{2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0700:JS>
      <[3><quietly>australia</quietly></[3></{3>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0705:CL>
      <[4>yeah yeah</[4></{4> <?>okay</?> <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0710:AD>
      mm mm <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0715:XX>
      yeah

  <WSC#DGZ060:0720:CL>
      er but i think it exemplifies my point that um you can't say
      that <.>thi</.> this is this is um <,> video adviser or
      computing adviser <?>cos</?> both of them have an <.>audi</.> an
      audio er element in them <{><[>and it's</[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0725:XX>
      <[><O>inhales</O></[></{> <.>could</.> <{><[><.>could</.></[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0730:DI>
      <[>what is</[></{> being proposed at <{1><[1>the moment <?>about
      about <{2><[2>restructure</?></[1></[2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0735:AD>
      <[1><?>well a a about about</?> this <.>n</.> nothing</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0740:JS>
      <[2>we don't know</[2></{2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0745:AD>
      <{><[>that's that's why it's not i <?>hadn't</?> i</[> i'd er
      reckon it's fair just to see what people here

  <WSC#DGZ060:0750:JS>
      <[>nothing so why don't we propose it</[></{>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0755:JS>
      i think it's a good <{><[>idea too</[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0760:AD>
      <[>thought i mean</[></{> i mean you know <.>h</.> how much is
      jasmine's loss going to be um a grave i mean as a <,> as a
      <unclear>word</unclear> <?>in the</?> <unclear>word</unclear>
      <{><[><O>laughs</O></[> going to be <?>felt</?> <drawls>um</drawls>
      and what might the repercussions be and how much <,> structuring
      does the new thing need <&>10:00</&>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0765:JS>
      <[><O>laughs</O></[></{>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0770:CL>
      well i just see this part and parcel of the <{1><[1>whole</[1>
      thing

  <WSC#DGZ060:0775:CL>
      we cut down the teaching staff and the quality of the teaching
      goes <laughs>down

  <WSC#DGZ060:0780:CL>
      now</laughs> now if we cut down the staff within the course
      <laughs>development</laughs> the quality of <{2><[2>the courses
      is going to go down</[2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0785:AD>
      <[1>mm</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0790:AD>
      <[2>mm mm</[2></{2> <{><[>mm</[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0795:XX>
      <[>mm</[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0800:DI>
      <[>but</[></{> that isn't really what we're suggesting is it <{><[><?>i
      mean just suggesting that</?> <unclear>word</unclear></[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0805:CL>
      <[>oh no we're not suggesting that but that's what they're
      that's what</[></{> they're doing to it

  <WSC#DGZ060:0810:DI>
      mm

  <WSC#DGZ060:0815:XX>
      mm <,> i mean <.>i</.> the question to me is is whether there is
      a need <drawls>for</drawls> <,> a p r position <,> or whether
      <,> it can be taken under the wing of general d t a but sort of
      <{1><[1>um kept <unclear>word</unclear></[1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0820:XX>
      yeah with <{2><[2>people</[2> who who have that <{3><[3>discretionary</[3>
      responsibility agree to get together from time to time <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0825:JS>
      <[1>with people <?>who'll take</?> responsibility</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0830:AD>
      <[2>mm</[2></{2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0835:JS>
      <[3>or whatever</[3></{3>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0840:AD>
      mm <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0845:XX>
      and i have to ADMIT <,> that <,> when i mainly was doing a a and
      not a lot else <,> it didn't take me nearly as <{1><[1>much</[1>
      time as say <{2><[2>a p r</[2> two senior teacher in a subject
      <{3><[3>area does

  <WSC#DGZ060:0850:XX>
      it</[3> just wasn't as big a job <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0855:JS>
      <[1>mm</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0860:JS>
      <[2><unclear>word</unclear></[2></{2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0865:JS>
      <[3>no way no way</[3></{3>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0870:JS>
      <.>jus</.> <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0875:XX>
      so if <&>11:00</&> <,> if we're looking at recommending that
      that a p r position be made we've either got to add some other
      duties to the p r position OR we've got to um suggest a p r one
      or <,> or something <{><[>cos</[> i mean i i think definitely we
      need to keep the focus

  <WSC#DGZ060:0880:JS>
      <[><?><.>i</.></?></[></{>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0885:JS>
      but i i think you know <{><[><unclear>word</unclear></[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0890:XX>
      <[><?>i mean it's just</?></[></{> how to do it

  <WSC#DGZ060:0895:JS>
      at one stage you know when oh who the hell was it er <O>tut</O>
      <,> philip jeffs was going round making a report

  <WSC#DGZ060:0900:AD>
      mm <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0905:JS>
      um we had meetings <,>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0910:JS>
      the two no with ken <?>from s a <{1><[1>t</?></[1> and colin <,>
      and ted <,,> and michael morrison that was for broadcasting and
      me <,> and i as as um <,> kind of audio <.>electron</.> <{2><[2><.>wh</.>
      what is it called</[2> <?>you go</?> <unclear>word</unclear> so
      electronic media something

  <WSC#DGZ060:0915:JS>
      we weren't even included in the thing <{3><[3>but</[3> there's
      always there seems to be this division that we MUST <&>12:00</&>
      have a leg in both camps in the production side and in the in
      the <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0920:XX>
      <[1>mm</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0925:XX>
      <[2><O>laughs</O></[2></{2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0930:XX>
      <[3>mm</[3></{3>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0935:AD>
      scripting and <{><[>development</[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0940:JS>
      <[>scripting</[></{> i mean in at the planning stage because <,>
      you see <,> a hell of a lot happens because di's part in the
      broadcasting and also used in tapes a lot and because i sit down
      here and i purposely put myself down here

  <WSC#DGZ060:0945:XX>
      but you're <{><[>part of the you're part of the</[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0950:JS>
      <[><unclear>word</unclear> right <O>voc</O> yes</[></{> a a and
      broadcasting

  <WSC#DGZ060:0955:DI>
      and e t a

  <WSC#DGZ060:0960:JS>
      <{><[>and e t a</[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0965:XX>
      <[>yes but</[></{> aren't you part of the <drawls>r</drawls> p d
      <{1><[1>committee</[1> that considers all plans for all courses

  <WSC#DGZ060:0970:XX>
      <{2><[2><unclear>word</unclear></[2> that's something i wanted
      to ask you <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0975:JS>
      <[1>yes i am</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0980:JS>
      <[2>yes but i'm not i'm</[2></{2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0985:JS>
      oh hang on i'm not i'm <{><[>not <?>talking about that</?></[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0990:XX>
      <[>can i ask you a question</[></{>

  <WSC#DGZ060:0995:XX>
      do you do you actually get involved in <drawls>all</drawls>
      course proposals or only <{1><[1>the</[1> ones where they've
      already asked for a tape

  <WSC#DGZ060:1000:XX>
      i mean do <{2><[2>you have the</[2> opportunity of doing what
      colin <{3><[3>suggested

  <WSC#DGZ060:1005:XX>
      that</[3> is saying if they haven't suggested a tape for this
      course but it would be much better if it had one <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1010:JS>
      <[1>yes</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1015:JS>
      <[2>no by the time</[2></{2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1020:JS>
      <[3>no no <unclear>word</unclear></[3></{3>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1025:JS>
      by the time well i don't get involved in all at all <&>13:00</&>
      now because i don't exist <{1><[1>but by the time the a a</[1>
      got involved it <{2><[2>was</[2> at after <?>p r</?> <,> three
      is it after the first proposal

  <WSC#DGZ060:1030:XX>
      <[1>right but when you did <O>laughs</O></[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1035:XX>
      <[2>mm</[2></{2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1040:XX>
      that you <{1><[1>were on the r p d group</[1> but not <{2><[2>the</[2>
      curriculum <{3><[3>group</[3>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1045:AD>
      <[1><?>it was the old p r four</?></[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1050:JS>
      <[2>yes</[2></{2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1055:JS>
      <[3>no</[3></{3> the curriculum

  <WSC#DGZ060:1060:JS>
      i was on the curriculum committee

  <WSC#DGZ060:1065:AD>
      <?>oh well in in that case</?> <{1><[1><O>inhales</O></[1> <{2><[2>but
      that that is actually is quite</[2> it actually really is quite
      <drawls>a</drawls> an important deletion

  <WSC#DGZ060:1070:AD>
      it means there's no <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1075:XX>
      <[1>right</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1080:JS>
      <[2>but because <unclear>word</unclear></[2></{2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1085:XX>
      right <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1090:JS>
      <{><[>well madeleine <?><&>surname</&></?></[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1095:AD>
      <[>there's no</[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1100:XX>
      <[>it means there's no</[></{> specific <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1105:AD>
      mm

  <WSC#DGZ060:1110:XX>
      tape <{1><[1>input into</[1> <{2><[2>considering the</[2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1115:JS>
      <[1>no <?><.>act</.></?></[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1120:AD>
      <[2>at the beginning</[2></{2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1125:JS>
      <?>return</?> <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1130:XX>
      mm <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1135:JS>
      but it was all it was at that stage already too late to suggest
      why don't you put <?>in tapes</?> because by that time they
      they've already said we want a course to include a b c d and e
      and i think what colin and <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1140:AD>
      that's not too late then <{1><[1><?>because it's</?></[1> <{2><[2><?>still
      it's only very early on</?></[2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1145:XX>
      <[1>it's not too late</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1150:DI>
      <[2>i actually see one of the</[2></{2> the ways that i can be
      the most helpful to a course is not only knowing the technical
      side of putting things together but i have a LOT of <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1155:JS>
      yes <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1160:DI>
      creative <&>14:00</&> <{1><[1>input</[1> in audio <{2><[2>terms</[2>
      and for that reason i think i could be better use right at early
      planning <{3><[3>stage</[3> in <{4><[4>in</[4> the writing

  <WSC#DGZ060:1165:AD>
      <[1><unclear>word</unclear></[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1170:JS>
      <[2>mm</[2></{2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1175:AD>
      <[3>mm</[3></{3>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1180:JS>
      <[4>mm</[4></{4>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1185:JS>
      mm <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1190:DI>
      um but i would suspect that anybody who is in the area of audio
      in the other sections like in production or in broadcasting and
      things also <?>has</?> that funny bent that creative bent which
      may WELL <,> add to courses particularly for the secondary
      courses in in a way which hasn't <{1><[1>really happened up</[1>
      <{2><[2>till</[2> now

  <WSC#DGZ060:1195:JS>
      <[1><?>they they don't use it</?></[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1200:AD>
      <[2>mm</[2></{2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1205:JS>
      <unclear>word</unclear> <{><[><unclear>word</unclear></[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1210:AD>
      <[><?><.>d</.> <.>d</.> do we</?></[></{> at the very least need
      to recommend that <,> that the potential for audio input needs
      to be <?>taken into account</?> by the curriculum committee
      especially now that jasmine is <?>not <{1><[1>here

  <WSC#DGZ060:1215:AD>
      i mean</?></[1> <{2><[2>does</[2> seem something which we <.>get</.>
      we at least we can at least say that no matter <,> what we say
      about <?>any <{3><[3>possible</?></[3> restructuring

  <WSC#DGZ060:1220:JS>
      <[1>yes</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1225:DI>
      <[2>mm</[2></{2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1230:XX>
      <[3>yeah</[3></{3>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1235:XX>
      i think it's quite important to to <drawls>um</drawls> sort of
      include madeleine in this <{><[>because obviously</[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1240:JS>
      <[><?>and she ought</?> she was</[></{> going to be here but
      <{1><[1>for</[1> some reason she didn't <{2><[2>come yes <,> <?>oh
      yes</?></[2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1245:XX>
      <[1>mm</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1250:XX>
      <[2>because you know the fact that</[2></{2> that <{1><[1>jasmine's</[1>
      job has been delegated to <{2><[2>madeleine</[2> <&>15:00</&>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1255:AD>
      <[1>mm</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1260:JS>
      <[2>madeleine</[2></{2> and the other <{1><[1>other</[1> <?>bit
      of <{2><[2>it has</?> <unclear>word</unclear></[2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1265:AD>
      <[1>mm</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1270:XX>
      <[2>um if we start</[2></{2> saying you know sort of it should
      happen this way or we suggest it happen that way <{><[><?>and</?></[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1275:AD>
      <[>mm</[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1280:DI>
      <[>can i</[></{> express my <,> unease at <,> this group being
      <,> taken over by d t a who are print text orientated people by
      and large <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1285:XX>
      mm <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1290:DI>
      <drawls>um</drawls>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1295:AD>
      you're welcome to write that down di <O>all laugh</O>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1300:DI>
      and i'm fearful that that the other ways of presenting learning
      material will be lost because of that <{><[>dominance</[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1305:JS>
      <[>yes</[></{>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1310:XX>
      yes

  <WSC#DGZ060:1315:JS>
      <unclear>word</unclear> <{><[><unclear>word</unclear></[>
      <unclear>word</unclear>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1320:AD>
      <[>mm</[></{>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1325:XX>
      <?>carried</?> <{><[><?>unanimously you'd say</?></[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1330:JS>
      <[><unclear>word</unclear></[></{> <{><[><unclear>word</unclear></[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1335:AD>
      <[><?>say yes</?></[></{> <{><[>yes</[> yes <,>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1340:AD>
      so <.>tho</.> those two <.>iss</.> issues the <.>pa</.> you know
      the <,> of that plus the <unclear>word</unclear> committee and
      the noninvolvement from now on so therefore the implicit um
      sidelining or the danger of sidelining other <&>16:00</&>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1345:XX>
      <[><O>laughs</O></[></{>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1350:XX>
      who are we <{1><[1>actually going</[1> to to <{2><[2>er submit
      this to <unclear>word</unclear></[2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1355:AD>
      <[1><unclear>word</unclear></[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1360:JS>
      <[2><?>madeleine madeleine</?> <unclear>word</unclear></[2></{2>
      madeleine <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1365:AD>
      i'm just writing out the <{><[>minutes</[> <?>just just minutes</?>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1370:XX>
      <[>or eileen?</[></{>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1375:JS>
      well madeleine can take it to eileen eileen

  <WSC#DGZ060:1380:AD>
      <?>but leave it out</?> <unclear>word</unclear> <?>with your
      minutes when we go</?>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1385:JS>
      oh i'll show you i've got <?>a list of <{><[>what i'd like to</?></[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1390:AD>
      <[><unclear>word</unclear></[></{> okay <{><[>right</[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1395:XX>
      <[>oh right</[></{>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1400:JS>
      they're just <?>minutes</?> <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1405:XX>
      <{><[>mm</[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1410:AD>
      <[>right</[></{> okay um

  <WSC#DGZ060:1415:AD>
      well <?>actually well perhaps those are the most have</?> <{1><[1>not
      much</[1> point i think going on past <{2><[2><?>restructuring</?></[2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1420:JS>
      <[1><unclear>word</unclear></[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1425:JS>
      <[2>there was one</[2></{2> other thing that pauline shaw who
      was one of the producers and she used to be in a a <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1430:AD>
      well that's <unclear>word</unclear> <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1435:JS>
      came to me only for <.>p</.> <?>have i done anything about about
      it can i give her any info</?>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1440:JS>
      er she's going to meet eileen because she's concerned about
      exactly the same thing that she doesn't think there's enough use
      made of audio tapes which are VERY CHEAP

  <WSC#DGZ060:1445:JS>
      i mean they're <{1><[1>relatively</[1> if you compare it with
      the c d rom i mean <,> help and there's not enough use being
      made for <&>17:00</&> it of them

  <WSC#DGZ060:1450:JS>
      particularly she's interested in i p s where kids see a text and
      they turn off

  <WSC#DGZ060:1455:JS>
      now <{2><[2>if they</[2> had some other different stimulus it
      might just start <{3><[3>them off</[3> <{4><[4>wouldn't it</[4>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1460:XX>
      <[1>mm</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1465:XX>
      <[2>mm</[2></{2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1470:XX>
      <[3>right</[3></{3>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1475:AD>
      <[4><?>so for the fact</[4></{4> <{><[>that</[> the that</?> the
      second item of the <unclear>word</unclear> this is really what
      di was saying too about the <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1480:XX>
      <[><.>jus</.></[></{>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1485:DI>
      mm <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1490:AD>
      early involvement so perhaps this i mean this links to the other
      <,> other item too so <{1><[1>perhaps</[1> we need to <?>we need</?>
      to state <,> in a in the you know the minutes our <,> <O>inhales</O>
      our concern for the <,> <?>about the we have a</?> need for
      early involvement of <,> audio advising <,> <{2><[2>before</[2>
      detailed planning starts

  <WSC#DGZ060:1495:??>
      <[1>mm</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1500:DI>
      <[2>designing</[2></{2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1505:XX>
      mm <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1510:AD>
      the courses <?>that's</?> <unclear>word</unclear> <O>laughs</O>
      <?>i i cut you off</?> <laughs>while i</laughs> was thinking of
      my <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1515:XX>
      mm <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1520:AD>
      <{><[><unclear>word</unclear></[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1525:CL>
      <[><unclear>word</unclear></[></{> i think the two things but
      i'm on record of saying this about the english teachers and i
      feel that <,> <.>we</.> we do a little bit of listening
      comprehension in the third and fourth form <{><[>cos it's</[>
      syllabus

  <WSC#DGZ060:1530:AD>
      <[>mm</[></{>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1535:AD>
      mm <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1540:CL>
      but i mean it <.>str</.> strikes me as rather peculiar when
      after all most <{1><[1>people actually listen</[1> far more in a
      day <laughs>than</laughs> they read and yet we emphasise reading
      comprehension and not listening comprehension <{2><[2>it's</[2>
      crazy <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1545:JS>
      <[1><?>it's pathetic</?></[1></{1> <&>18:00</&>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1550:XX>
      <[2>yes</[2></{2>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1555:JS>
      mhm

  <WSC#DGZ060:1560:CL>
      and the other thing is <unclear>word</unclear> social studies
      work and as an a a i i've been a social studies teacher
      <unclear>word</unclear> <?>planning i don't think a person's
      culture and</?> so much of a culture is transmitted <.>o</.> <.>au</.>
      aurally <{><[><?>and there's just</?></[> <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1565:JS>
      <[>yes yes</[></{>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1570:XX>
      <{><[>mm</[>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1575:AD>
      <[>mm</[></{> <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1580:CL>
      <?>this is in writing and</?> <unclear>word</unclear> <latch>

  <WSC#DGZ060:1585:JS>
      and they don't use it in the secondary much AT all <&>18:27</&>
</I>
