<I>

  <&>Wellington Corpus of Spoken New Zealand English Version One</&>
  <&>Copyright 1998 School of Linguistics & Applied Language Studies</&>
  <&>Victoria University of Wellington</&>

  <&>side one</&>
  <&>30:31</&>
  

  <WSC#DPC182:0005:MJ>
      how many of these interviews are you doing

  <WSC#DPC182:0010:RW>
      well we're trying to collect a million words of spoken new
      zealand english with a maximum of five thousand words from any
      one speaker <,> <O>inhales</O> <,>

  <WSC#DPC182:0015:RW>
      so the answer <laughs>ian is MASSES</laughs>

  <WSC#DPC182:0020:MJ>
      yes yes two hundred minimum

  <WSC#DPC182:0025:RW>
      yep <O>tut</O>

  <WSC#DPC182:0030:RW>
      and um <,,> one of the problems is that the staff there in the
      linguistics department are not new zealanders <,> <O>tut</O>
      terry's a <&>31:00</&> yorkshireman

  <WSC#DPC182:0035:RW>
      katherine's from liverpool

  <WSC#DPC182:0040:RW>
      sue kirk is from australia and freshly from australia audibly
      from australia

  <WSC#DPC182:0045:RW>
      and doug west although he has in fact been in new zealand for
      many many many years is australian by birth

  <WSC#DPC182:0050:RW>
      and he has a very young baby so that the amount of time that
      he's got to sort of <,> <O>tut</O> go round chatting to people
      is very limited

  <WSC#DPC182:0055:MJ>
      <O>voc</O>

  <WSC#DPC182:0060:RW>
      so that <O>voc</O> these people are <,> rather prevented from
      going and chatting to folk because it is well known that people
      do what we call accommodate linguistically the people they're
      talking to

  <WSC#DPC182:0065:RW>
      so that if you <{1><[1>were talking to terry</[1> you might
      shift in his direction and he would certainly shift in your
      direction <,>

  <WSC#DPC182:0070:RW>
      er but it can actually affect the <{2><[2><,> the output

  <WSC#DPC182:0075:RW>
      so the only one who's a

  <WSC#DPC182:0080:RW>
      <&>next utterance with exaggerated NZ accent</&> good genuine</[2>
      kiwi is good old me

  <WSC#DPC182:0085:RW>
      <O>laughs</O> <.>so</.> <&>rest of utterance addressed to FG</&>
      what time is your meal ready francie?

  <WSC#DPC182:0090:MJ>
      <[1>oh somebody's</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DPC182:0095:MJ>
      <[2>so the only one who can do the interviews is a new zealander</[2></{2>
      <&>32:00</&>

  <WSC#DPC182:0100:FG>
      oh <latch>

  <WSC#DPC182:0105:RW>
      just so i don't er <{><[>overstay</[>

  <WSC#DPC182:0110:FG>
      <[>no problem</[></{> it'll be about another <,> quarter of an
      hour

  <WSC#DPC182:0115:RW>
      fine okay well <.>we'll</.>

  <WSC#DPC182:0120:MJ>
      she has to do them all so as not to bias anyone's speaking
      habits <latch>

  <WSC#DPC182:0125:RW>
      <&>next utterance with exaggerated NZ accent</&> <.>i'm</.> <.>i'm</.>
      <.>i'm</.> i'm the only kiwi <O>laughter</O>

  <WSC#DPC182:0130:RW>
      all the others are are foreigners

  <WSC#DPC182:0135:FG>
      oh is that right

  <WSC#DPC182:0140:RW>
      yeah well terry's from yorkshire katherine's from liverpool
      <laughs>sue is from australia and doug west</laughs> was born in
      australia even if he has spent most of his life here <O>tut</O>

  <WSC#DPC182:0145:FG>
      oh

  <WSC#DPC182:0150:RW>
      so i'm the only genuine <,> kiwi

  <WSC#DPC182:0155:FG>
      mm

  <WSC#DPC182:0160:RW>
      so it falls to me

  <WSC#DPC182:0165:FG>
      to host all the sessions <latch>

  <WSC#DPC182:0170:RW>
      <.>to</.> to <,> <{><[>chat people</[> up

  <WSC#DPC182:0175:MJ>
      <[>how do you get</[></{> people

  <WSC#DPC182:0180:MJ>
      i would've thought you'd end up with a very biased <{><[>sample</[>

  <WSC#DPC182:0185:RW>
      <[>well</[></{> you do if you go to your own friends obviously
      um

  <WSC#DPC182:0190:RW>
      one of the reasons <.>wh</.> that terry did that radio talk was
      <{><[>to put out feelers</[> mm

  <WSC#DPC182:0195:FG>
      <[>was to bring in people from a</[></{> wider range

  <WSC#DPC182:0200:RW>
      um and <,,> um one of the things one of the things that that i'm
      doing is getting some of the secretaries around the university
      <&>33:00</&>

  <WSC#DPC182:0205:RW>
      <O>tut</O> who give you a slightly different

  <WSC#DPC182:0210:FG>
      group <latch>

  <WSC#DPC182:0215:RW>
      group of people <&>inhale</&>

  <WSC#DPC182:0220:RW>
      um what you hope to do really is to get them to get some of
      their FRIENDS to cooperate

  <WSC#DPC182:0225:FG>
      mm

  <WSC#DPC182:0230:RW>
      right and um i've had a number of cleaning ladies in the past

  <WSC#DPC182:0235:RW>
      and i shall <O>tut</O> <{1><[1>get my</[1> cleaning ladies to
      <O>laughs</O> to chat to me <{2><[2>i know them</[2>

  <WSC#DPC182:0240:FG>
      <[1>mhm</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DPC182:0245:FG>
      <[2><?>well <.>per</.></?></[2></{2> perhaps you want the people
      ian plays golf with because they would be a fairly
      representative selection

  <WSC#DPC182:0250:MJ>
      <drawls>no</drawls> they're probably <.>w</.> better off

  <WSC#DPC182:0255:FG>
      oh true money <{><[>yes</[>

  <WSC#DPC182:0260:RW>
      <[>yes</[></{> i mean the <.>oth</.> the other thing is that <.>y</.>
      i have said to katherine we must get the cleaning ladies at the
      university <,> those few of them that are not <,> polynesians
      <,> <O>tut</O>

  <WSC#DPC182:0265:RW>
      er i mean the vast majority are polynesians and not new zealand
      born so that they are not <,> <{><[>suitable material</[>

  <WSC#DPC182:0270:MJ>
      <[>er they don't qualify</[></{>

  <WSC#DPC182:0275:FG>
      <O>voc</O>

  <WSC#DPC182:0280:RW>
      mm

  <WSC#DPC182:0285:FG>
      oh <{><[><?>cos i mean the <.>people</.></?></[>

  <WSC#DPC182:0290:MJ>
      <[>does maori qualify</[></{>

  <WSC#DPC182:0295:RW>
      oh yes we in fact are aiming to get twelve percent <{><[>of this</[>
      sample maori as a representation of the population

  <WSC#DPC182:0300:RW>
      so i got my informant the other day <,> um <latch>

  <WSC#DPC182:0305:MJ>
      <[>oh</[></{> <&>34:00</&>

  <WSC#DPC182:0310:FG>
      our cleaner's a polynesian but <.>a</.> a male

  <WSC#DPC182:0315:RW>
      aha yes <.>well</.>

  <WSC#DPC182:0320:FG>
      interesting <latch>

  <WSC#DPC182:0325:RW>
      <{><[>interesting</[>

  <WSC#DPC182:0330:MJ>
      <[>some of the backgrounds</[></{>

  <WSC#DPC182:0335:FG>
      yes <latch>

  <WSC#DPC182:0340:RW>
      mm <,> <O>tut</O> and the <.>other</.> the other thing that <.>i</.>
      <.>i</.> i've said to katherine we MUST do is we must get the
      people on the BUILDING sites round the university

  <WSC#DPC182:0345:RW>
      as i walk past the buildings you know i hear these amazing
      conversations from up aloft <O>laughter</O>

  <WSC#DPC182:0350:RW>
      <laughs>and i think yeah i just want my tape recorder right now</laughs>
      because you know <.>tho</.> that's a totally different section
      of the <{1><[1>population</[1>

  <WSC#DPC182:0355:RW>
      and harry orsman who um is working on the new zealand dictionary
      and who's not actually in linguistics has been a great
      frequenter of pubs and has collected many you know masses of of
      sort of nice data from the pubs

  <WSC#DPC182:0360:RW>
      and we're hoping to twist his arm and persuade HIM to go and
      chat up these blokes on the building sites because he would do
      it much better than any of the <{2><[2>rest of us</[2>

  <WSC#DPC182:0365:FG>
      <[1>yes</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DPC182:0370:FG>
      <[2>you think he would have</[2></{2> the right technique
      <latch>

  <WSC#DPC182:0375:RW>
      i mean i sort of feel RATHER ill at ease about the <laughs>thought
      of going and trying to chat up a whole lot of men on a building
      site</laughs> <latch>

  <WSC#DPC182:0380:FG>
      you might not be the most appropriate <{><[>person</[>

  <WSC#DPC182:0385:RW>
      <[>might not</[></{> be the most appropriate <{1><[1>person</[1>
      <&>35:00</&> that's what i feel <,>

  <WSC#DPC182:0390:RW>
      <O>tut</O> but it's actually <.>k</.> it's quite difficult and
      we hope the other people from the other universities are also
      collecting data

  <WSC#DPC182:0395:RW>
      they're supposed to be but as far as <{2><[2>we <.>know</.></[2>

  <WSC#DPC182:0400:FG>
      <[1>no</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DPC182:0405:FG>
      <[2>so</[2></{2> how many conversations are you endeavouring to
      record altogether

  <WSC#DPC182:0410:RW>
      we were supposed to get a <.>h</.> a million words of spoken new
      zealand english

  <WSC#DPC182:0415:FG>
      how many HOURS

  <WSC#DPC182:0420:RW>
      um

  <WSC#DPC182:0425:MJ>
      you're going quite rapidly if you took three words a minute er
      three words a SECOND <latch>

  <WSC#DPC182:0430:FG>
      how many did aunt <?><.>ais</.></?> er aunt daisy

  <WSC#DPC182:0435:FG>
      she was supposed to be a really <{><[>fast speaker wasn't she?</[>

  <WSC#DPC182:0440:RW>
      <[>well <.>we</.> yes we</[></{> reckon that um something like a
      quarter of an hour's talk gives you about five thousand words

  <WSC#DPC182:0445:FG>
      mm <O>laughter</O>

  <WSC#DPC182:0450:RW>
      all right

  <WSC#DPC182:0455:RW>
      so it's quite a lot of talk involved <,,>

  <WSC#DPC182:0460:RW>
      but um

  <WSC#DPC182:0465:MJ>
      it's a lot easier with a tape recorder then

  <WSC#DPC182:0470:RW>
      well yes um <,>

  <WSC#DPC182:0475:RW>
      but no these things are very

  <WSC#DPC182:0480:RW>
      it's very strange but <,>

  <WSC#DPC182:0485:RW>
      somebody has to actually go out and collect the data that's the
      big that's really the big problem <,> getting enough data <,>
      <&>36:00</&>

  <WSC#DPC182:0490:RW>
      but my my maori informant it's funny she said to me yes you can
      do it as long as i don't know you're doing it

  <WSC#DPC182:0495:FG>
      ah <O>laughs</O> <{><[>so</[>

  <WSC#DPC182:0500:RW>
      <[>so</[></{> i took my tape recorder along in my satchel i got
      a specially little tape recorder so it would fit in my satchel
      and i had this just draped over the outside of my satchel you
      see so it was fairly inconspicuous <latch>

  <WSC#DPC182:0505:FG>
      <unclear>word</unclear>

  <WSC#DPC182:0510:RW>
      i put that down under the table where she wouldn't see it <,>
      and i had the thing all set to go and on pause so all i had to
      do was gently press one button you see when i arrived

  <WSC#DPC182:0515:RW>
      and she didn't notice and i i said right

  <WSC#DPC182:0520:RW>
      she she she's a she's a member of the ratana church <,> and
      she'd been up to their easter conference <,>

  <WSC#DPC182:0525:RW>
      and i KNEW that when she came back i could get her to talk about
      ratana <,> <O>tut</O> and it WORKED like a charm you know i
      pressed the button and she she talked and talked and talked and
      talked and talked

  <WSC#DPC182:0530:FG>
      and WAS the recording satisfactory <&>37:00</&>

  <WSC#DPC182:0535:RW>
      well unfortunately there was a radio on in the background which
      was not very nice <latch>

  <WSC#DPC182:0540:FG>
      mm

  <WSC#DPC182:0545:RW>
      um but yes i think so <O>tut</O> and you know she was she was
      totally involved in explaining to me about the revelations of er
      <,> <{><[>and the miracles</[>

  <WSC#DPC182:0550:MJ>
      <[>you should try and</[></{> record the talkback shows on the
      radio

  <WSC#DPC182:0555:RW>
      you actually have to have permission to do this from the
      individual speakers concerned

  <WSC#DPC182:0560:MJ>
      oh one after the other mm? <latch>

  <WSC#DPC182:0565:RW>
      er yes um i mean you're actually not allowed <,> to use material
      of that kind without people's permission <,>

  <WSC#DPC182:0570:RW>
      um

  <WSC#DPC182:0575:FG>
      <{><[>mm</[>

  <WSC#DPC182:0580:MJ>
      <[>mm</[></{> all right <O>laughs</O>

  <WSC#DPC182:0585:RW>
      i mean radio <.>is</.>

  <WSC#DPC182:0590:RW>
      i mean we we will be getting some radio stuff but we're actually
      going to have to get permission from <latch>

  <WSC#DPC182:0595:FG>
      so you can't do things such as travelling in a bus or going into
      a public place of any kind <latch>

  <WSC#DPC182:0600:RW>
      yeah well we're not sure because we DO want some surreptitious
      data and <.>par</.> you know we want to bug a few telephone
      conversations <{><[>so we want <.>to</.></[>

  <WSC#DPC182:0605:FG>
      <[>oh now we</[></{> know you can't do that

  <WSC#DPC182:0610:RW>
      we know you can't do that that's right

  <WSC#DPC182:0615:RW>
      um <O>tut</O> but we also want to um get a few sort of shop
      assistants' assistance <&>38:00</&>

  <WSC#DPC182:0620:FG>
      mm

  <WSC#DPC182:0625:RW>
      to get some recordings of <.>inter</.> interchanges in shops

  <WSC#DPC182:0630:FG>
      but you'd have to have the customer <{><[><?>in on it</?> as
      well</[>

  <WSC#DPC182:0635:RW>
      <[>mm that's the</[></{> problem <latch>

  <WSC#DPC182:0640:FG>
      mm

  <WSC#DPC182:0645:RW>
      it it really it really is a problem because there is this nasty
      legal thing about <,> theoretically you shouldn't <,> use people
      <,> unless you have their permission <latch>

  <WSC#DPC182:0650:FG>
      but as soon as you have their permission they know you're doing
      it <{><[>and they don't</[> speak in the same manner

  <WSC#DPC182:0655:RW>
      <[><.>that's</.></[></{>

  <WSC#DPC182:0660:RW>
      maybe <latch>

  <WSC#DPC182:0665:FG>
      mm

  <WSC#DPC182:0670:RW>
      mm <,> <O>tut</O> yes it's difficult

  <WSC#DPC182:0675:RW>
      there are all sorts of things about surreptitious recordings
      that are different from <,,> from sort of

  <WSC#DPC182:0680:MJ>
      just listening <latch>

  <WSC#DPC182:0685:RW>
      except you know recordings where people are aware that the thing
      is there <,,>

  <WSC#DPC182:0690:RW>
      but it's just a case really of getting who we can

  <WSC#DPC182:0695:MJ>
      mm

  <WSC#DPC182:0700:RW>
      <.>and</.> <latch>

  <WSC#DPC182:0705:FG>
      <.>i</.> is this adults only? <.>or</.>

  <WSC#DPC182:0710:RW>
      have to be more than sixteen <{><[>yes</[>

  <WSC#DPC182:0715:RW>
      otherwise it would be quite fun to go and tape five year olds
      but um their speech is immature in all SORTS of ways
      <&>39:00</&>

  <WSC#DPC182:0720:FG>
      <[>mm</[></{>

  <WSC#DPC182:0725:FG>
      mm

  <WSC#DPC182:0730:RW>
      i mean <,,>

  <WSC#DPC182:0735:RW>
      i it it's it's fascinating

  <WSC#DPC182:0740:RW>
      i'm quite convinced that <&>inhale</&> um while it's been
      commonly said in linguistic circles that kids basically know
      their language by the age of five that is NOT <,> my perception
      <&>inhale</&>

  <WSC#DPC182:0745:RW>
      i would actually very much like to <,,> <O>voc</O> GET some data

  <WSC#DPC182:0750:FG>
      to trace the

  <WSC#DPC182:0755:RW>
      yes to <{><[>actually see <,> when</[> it does happen

  <WSC#DPC182:0760:FG>
      <[>development <,> from one age to another</[></{> mm <,>

  <WSC#DPC182:0765:FG>
      what would the indicators be

  <WSC#DPC182:0770:RW>
      well there are all sorts of things

  <WSC#DPC182:0775:RW>
      i mean one of the interesting things seems to me that keith's
      friends <.>wh</.> i mean now they're about ten now all of them
      <,> STILL have the same phonological mistakes that they had when
      they were five <,>

  <WSC#DPC182:0780:RW>
      <{1><[1><O>tut</O> so</[1> those of them that can't say keith
      <{2><[2><,> still can't say</[2> keith

  <WSC#DPC182:0785:FG>
      <[1>mm</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DPC182:0790:FG>
      <[2>still can't say</[2></{2>

  <WSC#DPC182:0795:RW>
      they still say keif

  <WSC#DPC182:0800:FG>
      all right mm

  <WSC#DPC182:0805:RW>
      <.>and</.>

  <WSC#DPC182:0810:FG>
      but adults DON'T <latch> <&>40:00</&>

  <WSC#DPC182:0815:RW>
      adults don't <{><[>and <.>that's</.> at</[> what point?

  <WSC#DPC182:0820:RW>
      yes er i suspect that it's the sort of years of puberty when
      there is peer pressure <,> to suddenly drop what is seen as a
      baby habit

  <WSC#DPC182:0825:FG>
      <[>so at <?>a specific moment</?></[></{>

  <WSC#DPC182:0830:FG>
      mm when <,> thumb sucking must stop <{><[>if it hasn't before</[>

  <WSC#DPC182:0835:RW>
      <[><drawls>well</drawls></[></{> if it hasn't before <{><[>yes
      <?>and always</?></[>

  <WSC#DPC182:0840:FG>
      <[>mm or any</[></{> anything that can be seen in ANY way

  <WSC#DPC182:0845:RW>
      as being <{1><[1>childish yes yes</[1>

  <WSC#DPC182:0850:RW>
      that's when i think these things get dropped <O>inhales</O>

  <WSC#DPC182:0855:RW>
      but syntactically as well i hear all sorts of strange things
      from keith's friends which suggest to me that they really still
      at the age of ten don't have <,,> er <,> proper command of their
      <{2><[2><,></[2> own language

  <WSC#DPC182:0860:FG>
      <[1>less than grown up mm</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DPC182:0865:FG>
      <[2><?>and</?></[2></{2>

  <WSC#DPC182:0870:FG>
      sometime <{><[>between then and adulthood</[>

  <WSC#DPC182:0875:MJ>
      <[>er what do you hear from</[></{> adults <O>laughs</O>

  <WSC#DPC182:0880:RW>
      yeah that i think is the interesting question

  <WSC#DPC182:0885:RW>
      i mean as a sort of <,,><&>3</&> measure of this you obviously
      have to have a <{1><[1><unclear>word</unclear> body of</[1>
      adult speech to compare it with and <{2><[2>say</[2> okay this
      is obviously going to be what they're what they should be doing
      at <,> at the end of it

  <WSC#DPC182:0890:RW>
      this is what we have to take as as the goal <latch>

  <WSC#DPC182:0895:FG>
      <[1>the adult speech</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DPC182:0900:FG>
      <[2>mm</[2></{2> <&>41:00</&>

  <WSC#DPC182:0905:FG>
      yes <latch>

  <WSC#DPC182:0910:RW>
      at what point do they actually reach that goal <latch>

  <WSC#DPC182:0915:FG>
      because if the parents have <latch>

  <WSC#DPC182:0920:RW>
      mm <{><[>nonstandard or yes</[>

  <WSC#DPC182:0925:FG>
      <[>less than perfect</[></{> command then you can't expect that
      the <{><[>children</[>

  <WSC#DPC182:0930:RW>
      <[>no</[></{> <{><[>precisely</[>

  <WSC#DPC182:0935:FG>
      <[>unless</[></{> they have a different <{1><[1><?>life</?></[1>
      experience are going to <{2><[2>increase</[2> their command
      beyond their parents' <latch>

  <WSC#DPC182:0940:RW>
      <[1>right</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DPC182:0945:RW>
      <[2>so yeah</[2></{2>

  <WSC#DPC182:0950:RW>
      yeah so ideally what i think you would wish to do would be to
      record the same group of children <,> every year of their life
      from say five to fifteen

  <WSC#DPC182:0955:FG>
      mm

  <WSC#DPC182:0960:RW>
      and i think you would have to take it that by fifteen <,>
      they've got what they're going to have

  <WSC#DPC182:0965:FG>
      mm

  <WSC#DPC182:0970:RW>
      barring maybe a few words

  <WSC#DPC182:0975:RW>
      oh that would that is after that they're likely only to add
      items of vocabulary i'd've thought

  <WSC#DPC182:0980:FG>
      yes special interest areas

  <WSC#DPC182:0985:RW>
      right

  <WSC#DPC182:0990:FG>
      mm

  <WSC#DPC182:0995:RW>
      but ideally that's what you would do and then you would <,> you
      would have far too much <laughs>data <,> you'd have to have a
      computer that could actually analyse it for you</laughs>
      <&>42:00</&>

  <WSC#DPC182:1000:MJ>
      <O>tut</O> <{><[><unclear>word</unclear></[>

  <WSC#DPC182:1005:FG>
      <[>do you mean</[></{> this is NOT being analysed by computer

  <WSC#DPC182:1010:RW>
      some of this will be <{><[>yes</[> but computers are in fact not
      particularly good at linguistic analysis yet

  <WSC#DPC182:1015:FG>
      <[>mm</[></{>

  <WSC#DPC182:1020:FG>
      well i can understand that word recognition would be a problem

  <WSC#DPC182:1025:RW>
      yes <latch>

  <WSC#DPC182:1030:FG>
      but i would've thought that once you'd identified the words you
      could use the computer to analyse <,> word frequency and things
      like that

  <WSC#DPC182:1035:RW>
      <O>inhales</O> <drawls>yes</drawls> <?>i mean</?> count lexical
      items is is okay <{1><[1>but</[1> er for computers to do
      syntactic analysis <{2><[2><,> is</[2> actually very difficult

  <WSC#DPC182:1040:RW>
      but <?>i mean</?> amongst other things we're interested in doing
      <,> syntactic analysis

  <WSC#DPC182:1045:FG>
      <[1>mm</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DPC182:1050:FG>
      <[2>oh yes</[2></{2>

  <WSC#DPC182:1055:FG>
      <drawls>ah</drawls> <{><[>artificial</[> intelligence <,>

  <WSC#DPC182:1060:FG>
      knowledge engineering

  <WSC#DPC182:1065:RW>
      <[>er</[></{>

  <WSC#DPC182:1070:RW>
      <{><[>yes i mean all of <.>these</.></[>

  <WSC#DPC182:1075:MJ>
      <[>mm and</[></{> it doesn't work yet either <O>laughter</O>

  <WSC#DPC182:1080:RW>
      no well precisely so that a lot of this is actually gonna have
      to be done analysed manually

  <WSC#DPC182:1085:FG>
      mm how tedious

  <WSC#DPC182:1090:RW>
      how tedious yes <.>but</.>

  <WSC#DPC182:1095:MJ>
      we shall have a word with er the minister of education and say i
      think you'd better check up where your research money's going
      <&>43:00</&> <O>laughter</O>

  <WSC#DPC182:1100:RW>
      well <.>there</.> there are to be two <.>post</.> doctoral
      fellows one at canterbury and one here <,> next year <,> to work
      on this project

  <WSC#DPC182:1105:RW>
      and they're hoping to get somebody in one of the two
      appointments who will <,> know what there is to be known about
      <,> er machine parsing

  <WSC#DPC182:1110:FG>
      mm <latch>

  <WSC#DPC182:1115:RW>
      about syntactic analysis by machine so that we can get <,> you
      know done what we can by machine <,> but um <,>

  <WSC#DPC182:1120:FG>
      it's a fascinating field

  <WSC#DPC182:1125:RW>
      it is yes

  <WSC#DPC182:1130:FG>
      mm i was in fact reading a little bit about <,> one or two <,>
      examples of knowledge engineering that are <,> being taken on by
      our company in australia <latch>

  <WSC#DPC182:1135:RW>
      mhm

  <WSC#DPC182:1140:FG>
      one of them was to do with <,> the allocation of locomotives <,>
      within a railway system <{1><[1>where they</[1> SAID <,> that
      they had <,> six thousand locomotives <{2><[2>and they</[2> had
      two hundred people <O>tut</O> um apparently fulltime manually
      <&>44:00</&> allocating locomotives

  <WSC#DPC182:1145:FG>
      this doesn't feel real i'm going to have to <{3><[3>check
      whether it could possibly be so</[3>

  <WSC#DPC182:1150:RW>
      <[1><drawls>oh</drawls></[1></{1>

  <WSC#DPC182:1155:RW>
      <[2><?>good</?></[2></{2>

  <WSC#DPC182:1160:RW>
      <[3>that doesn't <.>sound</.>

  <WSC#DPC182:1165:RW>
      it</[3></{3> sounds as if there must be an extra NAUGHT on that
      <{><[><?>tally</?></[>

  <WSC#DPC182:1170:FG>
      <[>well there</[></{> may be <O>laughter</O>

  <WSC#DPC182:1175:FG>
      so um

  <WSC#DPC182:1180:RW>
      <{><[>that seems incredible</[>

  <WSC#DPC182:1185:MJ>
      <[><?>the</?> major</[></{> problem with the railways is losing
      wagons

  <WSC#DPC182:1190:FG>
      for months on sidings

  <WSC#DPC182:1195:RW>
      good lord

  <WSC#DPC182:1200:FG>
      and it's not just the wagons it's what's <{><[>loaded ON the
      wagons</[> <latch>

  <WSC#DPC182:1205:RW>
      <[>what's IN them</[></{>

  <WSC#DPC182:1210:RW>
      yes <O>laughter</O>

  <WSC#DPC182:1215:RW>
      yes perhaps that's what's happened to my curtains <O>laughs</O>

  <WSC#DPC182:1220:FG>
      <drawls>oh</drawls>

  <WSC#DPC182:1225:MJ>
      <?>you ever</?> look at the wellington railway station even from
      <{1><[1>a</[1> photo from the <{2><[2>air and</[2> it's very
      very big <latch>

  <WSC#DPC182:1230:RW>
      <[1>yeah</[1></{1>

  <WSC#DPC182:1235:RW>
      <[2>yes</[2></{2>

  <WSC#DPC182:1240:RW>
      it's it's very messy too <{><[>mm</[>

  <WSC#DPC182:1245:MJ>
      <[>and</[></{> um <latch>

  <WSC#DPC182:1250:RW>
      mm

  <WSC#DPC182:1255:MJ>
      and the railways put in i think there's <?>tendon</?> computers
      there <,>

  <WSC#DPC182:1260:MJ>
      they were reading the marks on the outside whenever they went
      past

  <WSC#DPC182:1265:RW>
      oh <latch>

  <WSC#DPC182:1270:MJ>
      so they'd record at least that this wagon went <{><[>past here</[>

  <WSC#DPC182:1275:RW>
      <[>past here</[></{> <O>laughter</O>

  <WSC#DPC182:1280:FG>
      if you tried to track it back you would be able to find where it
      was last seen <latch>

  <WSC#DPC182:1285:RW>
      seen mm

  <WSC#DPC182:1290:FG>
      which would give you a better chance of finding <{><[>where it
      was</[> now <latch> <&>45:00</&>

  <WSC#DPC182:1295:RW>
      <[>finding it</[></{>

  <WSC#DPC182:1300:RW>
      that's amazing isn't it <,>

  <WSC#DPC182:1305:RW>
      no wonder railways are so inefficient <&>45:08</&>
</I>
