Whereas , in truth , the said William Ireland did not take his leave of him the said Titus Oates , or of any other Person whatsoever , at his the said William Ireland 's Chamber , then being in Russel-street aforesaid , between the said 8 th and 12 th Day of August , in the Year of our Lord 1678 . (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.2) And so the said Titus Oates did then and there commit willful and corrupt Perjury . (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.3) And this is laid to be to the great Displeasure of Almighty God , in contempt of the Laws of this Land , to the evil and pernicious Example of all others in the like Case offending , and against the King's Peace , Crown and Dignity . (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.4) To this he has pleaded , Not Guilty . (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.5) If we prove it , we do not question , (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.6) but you will find him Guilty . (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.7) Mr. Att. Gen. May it please your Lordship , and you Gentlemen of the Jury ; Mr. Oates stands indicted for having perjured himself ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.8) The Instances Gentlemen , that we charge him with , are these : (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.9) First , What he swore at the Trial of Ireland ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.10) and we say , that at that Trial he did swear Ireland was in Town the 1st or 2d of September , 1678 . (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.11) The second Instance is , what he swore at the Trial of the five Jesuits : (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.12) and there we say , he did swear , that Ireland was in Town between the 8 th and 12 th of August , and that he took his leave of him here in Town at his Chamber in Russel-street ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.13) and we do charge him by this Indictment , that he has forsworn himself in both Instances : And that Ireland , Gentlemen , was neither-1 in Town between the 8 th and 12 th of August , nor the 1 st or 2 d of September . (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.14) And we shall make it out very evidently : (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.15) For , Gentlemen , as to the Proof in this Case , our Case stands thus : (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.16) we say , that the 3 d of August , 1678 , Ireland went into Hertfordshire , to a House of my Lord Aston's , and from then went into Staffordshire . (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.17) I will not stand to open the Particulars where he was every Day ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.18) but we shall give you an Account , in a Method very easy to be remembered and observed , where he was till the 14 th of September . (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.19) But one remarkable Instance , Gentlemen , I desire to take particular notice of ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.20) and that is , the Time of Pancras Fair , which is upon the 2 d of September always , a known Day , and a known Place in that Country . (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.21) Now we have among the rest , many Witnesses to prove , that Mr. Ireland was there that Day , and not in Town . (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.22) And when we have proved this , as we shall by a whole Cloud of Witnesses , I believe , you Gentlemen of this Jury , will no more doubt that Mr. Oates is forsworn in these Particulars , than the Jury yesterday did in that Particular ; nor than , I believe , the whole Kingdom does by this time . (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.23) Mr. Sol. Gen. My Lord , we shall go to our Evidence ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.24) and first , we produce the Records of the two Trials of Ireland , the five Jesuits . (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.25) Swear Mr. Swift . (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.26) Which was done . (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.27) Pray , Sir , put in the Records . Are those true Copies ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.28) Mr. Swift . My Lord , I examined these Records with the Originals , (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.29) and they are true Copies {COM:sic_punctuation} ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.30) Mr. Att. Gen. Mr. Oates , will you have them read ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.31) Or to save the time of the Court , will you agree them ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.32) Oates . My Lord , I consent to save the time of the Court ; if they shall be made use of for Evidence for me . (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.33) L. C. J. No doubt they are Evidence for you as well as against you , when they are produced here . (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.34) Mr. Sol. Gen. If Mr. Oates does admit the Records then shall we go on , and prove what he did swear at those Trials ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.35) and for the first part of the time , which is between the 8 th and 12 th of August , 1678 , we desire that Mr. Thomas Harriot , and Mr. Rainsford Waterhouse may be sworn . (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.36) Which was done . (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.37) Mr. Att. Gen. Mr. Harriot , pray , do you remember at the Trial of the five Jesuits , was Mr. Oates produced and sworn as a Witness ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.38) Mr. Harriot . Yes , he was , My Lord . (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.39) Mr. Att. Gen. Do you remember what Testimony he gave about Ireland 's being in Town , and when it was , he said , he was in Town ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.40) Mr. Harriot . My Lord , he did positively swear , that Mr. Ireland , the late Jesuit , did take his leave of him , the said Oates and others , at the said Ireland 's Chamber in Russel-street , betwixt the 8 th and 12 th of August , 1678 . (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.41) Mr. Sol. Gen. Were you of the Jury that tried the five Jesuits , Mr. Harriot . (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.42) Mr. Harriot . Yes , I was Foreman of that Jury . (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.43) Mr. Sol. Gen. What say you , Mr. Waterhouse ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.44) Were you present at the Trial ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.45) Mr. Waterhouse . Yes , I was of the Jury too . (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.46) Mr. Sol. Gen. What did Oates swear at that Trial ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.47) Mr. Waterhouse . He said , that Mr. Ireland took his leave of him the 12 th of August . (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.48) My Lord Chief Justice Scroggs then asked him , are you sure it was the 12 th ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.49) And then he said , he would not be positive it was the 12 th , (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.50) but between the 8 th and the 12 th it was , (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.51) I am positive upon my Oath . (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.52) Mr. Att. Gen. It is so in the Print too , (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.53) but we will now go on . (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.54) L. C. J. But will the Defendant ask these Witnesses any Questions ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.55) Oates . My Lord , if your Lordship please , I will ask Mr. Harriot a Question . (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.56) L. C. J. Ay , do ask him what you will . (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.57) Oates . Mr. Harriot , did I swear , that he took his leave of me , or I took my leave of him ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.58) --- Mr. Harriot . You swore , that Ireland took his leave of you and others , between the 8 th and 12 th of August , 1678 ; between those two Days , and in that Year . (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.59) Mr. Just. Withins . It is a nice Question that of your's , Mr. Oates , upon my Word . (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.60) Oates . My Lord , I know what reason I have to ask that Question ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,71.61) I am sure in Perjury , the Court ought to keep up the Witnesses strictly to what is laid in the Indictment . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.62) L. C. J. Well , you have his Answer according to the Indictment . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.63) Oates . Pray , my Lord , be pleased to ask Mr. Harriot this Question , Whether he took Notes of the Trial ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.64) --- Mr. Harriot . Yes , I did so , Sir . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.65) Oates , My Lord , I desire to know of Mr. Harriot , Whether he has those Notes by him ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.66) Mr. Harriot . No , Sir , I have them not here ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.67) but I have had them by me this four or five Years , or more . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.68) It was my manner in all the Trials , wherein I was concerned as a Jury-Man , to read the Trials strictly over , when they were printed , especially where I happened to have any Notes that I took at the Trial , and to compare the printed Trial with my Notes ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.69) and where I found anything doubtful , I used to put a Query upon it . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.70) And this and many other things , I found to be in the printed Trials strictly according to my Notes . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.71) Oates . My Lord , I desire to know , what Trial he was Foreman at ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.72) Mr. Harriot . That of the five Jesuits , in June ; the 13 th of June , 1679 . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.73) L. C. J. Have you any thing to ask Mr. Waterhouse ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.74) Oates . Yes , my Lord . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.75) Pray , Sir , let me ask you a Question . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.76) Mr. Waterhouse . Ay , if you please , Sir . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.77) Oates . Did you take Notes of that Trial you speak of , Sir ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.78) Mr. Waterhouse . No , I did not . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.79) Oates . How come you there to remember this , that I was so positive as to the time betwixt the 8 th and 12 th of August ? Mr. Waterhouse . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.80) Because I was one of the Jury ; and because my Lord Chief Justice made a stop , when you said , $'t $was {TEXT:'twas} the 12 th of August , and bad you consider : (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.81) And you consider'd , and consider'd it (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.82) and did affirm positively , that it was between the 8 th and 12 th of August . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.83) L. C. J. He gives you a plain Reason for his Remembrance . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.84) Oates . My Lord , I have done with him . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.85) Mr. Sol. Gen. Then we desire Mr. Foster may be sworn . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.86) Which was done . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.87) Mr. Foster , Pray will you tell what you remember Mr. Oates swore at Mr. Ireland 's Trial , about Ireland 's being in Town ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.88) Mr. Foster . I was one of the Jury at the Trial of Mr. Ireland , Mr. Pickering , and Mr. Grove ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.89) and I did see Mr. Oates sworn , as a Witness for the King , at that Trial ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.90) and so was Mr. Bedloe : (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.91) And Bedloe there gave Evidence , that there was a Meeting at Harcourt 's Chamber ; and Ireland , Grove , and Pickering were there : And that this was the latter End of August . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.92) Mr. Ireland did make his Defence , as much as he could , to prove , that he was not in Town from the Beginning of August to the Middle of September ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.93) and brought divers Witnesses . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.94) But upon his denying to be here the latter End of August , Mr. Oates did come and swear : (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.95) I am certain says he that the first and second of September he was in Town ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.96) for then I had of him Twenty Shillings . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.97) Oates . Was I positive , that he was here in Town the 1st or 2d of September ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.98) --- Mr. Foster . You were positive , Sir , to the 1st or 2d ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.99) I have it in my Notes in Writing . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.100) L. C. J. He tells you , it is in his Notes : (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.101) And therefore $he $'s {TEXT:he's} sure you said so . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.102) Mr. Att. Gen. In the printed Copy , if it be right , there is mention made of the Word Positive . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.103) L. C. J. I think , that is in August , between the 8th or 12th , he was positive . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.104) Oates . Did I say these Words , I was positive ? --- Mr. Waterhouse . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.105) I say , you affirmed that he was in Town the 1st or 2d of September . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.106) L. C. J. It is not necessary , that you should use the Word Positive : (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.107) The Question is , Whether it was positively affirmed ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.108) Mr. Just. Withins . Was not that true that you said ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.109) Did not you affirm a positive Truth ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.110) --- Oates . My Lord , $I $'ll {TEXT:I'll} tell you the Reason why I ask the Question , because I have forgot myself , whether I used the Word or no ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.111) and therefore I ask for my own Information now . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.112) L. C. J. Well , ask for what Reason you will , (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.113) you have received an Answer to your Question ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.114) and upon my Word he gives a notable Evidence : (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.115) Says he , Bedloe had sworn a treasonable Practice by Ireland , in the latter end of August . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.116) Then Ireland comes , (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.117) and make {COM:sic} his Defence : (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.118) Says he , That $can $not {TEXT:cannot} be ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.119) for I was out of Town at that time ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.120) I was not in London all August , nor the beginning of September . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.121) Then come you in to support the Testimony of Bedloe , (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.122) and swear , that he was in Town the 1st or 2d of September ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.123) for then he gave you twenty Shillings . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.124) And so you come to rivet the Matter that was sworn before by Bedloe . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.125) Oates . My Lord , what I swore was Truth . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.126) L. C. J. That is now to be tried . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.127) Mr. Att. Gen. We have another of the Jury here , Mr. John Byfield : (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.128) Pray , swear him . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.129) Which was done . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.130) Mr. Sol. Gen. Well , Sir , what did you hear Oates swear at that Trial ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.131) Mr. Byfield . I heard the same that they have testified before . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.132) L. C. J. But you must tell us what that was . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.133) Mr. Sol. Gen. Were you a Jury-man at that Trial ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.134) Mr. Byfield . Yes , I had a Summons to the Old-Bailey (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.135) --- L. C. J. But what did Oates swear ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.136) $That $'s {TEXT:That's} the Question . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.137) Mr. Byfield . Mr. Oates did positively assert , that Ireland was here in Town the 1st or 2d of September ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.138) and to confirm it , he said , he received of him twenty Shillings . (OATES-E3-P1,4,72.139) {COM:insert_helsinki_1} Mr. Just. Withins . Well , what do you ask this Gentleman , Mr. Attorney ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.142) Mr. Att. Gen. We desire Sir Edward Southcoat would give an account , whether he met Mr. Ireland at my Lord Aston 's ? And when ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.143) Sir Edw. Southcoat . I was with my Lord Aston in his Company . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.144) L. C. J. When was that , Sir ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.145) Sir Edw. Southcoat . The 4th of August I saw Mr. Ireland at my Lord Aston 's . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.146) L. C. J. Was it the same Ireland that was afterwards tried and executed ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.147) Sir Edw. Southcoat . It was the same Ireland that was commonly reported : (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.148) I did not see him executed . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.149) Mr. Att. Gen. Was it the same that was reputed to be this old Gentlewoman's Son ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.150) --- Sir Edw. Southcoat . Yes , it was . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.151) L. C. J. Pray , Sir , go on with your Evidence . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.152) Sir Edw. Southcoat . Upon Monday we began our Journey to Tixhall , (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.153) and went that Night to St. Albans , where we met my Father and Mother , (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.154) and thence we continued on our Journey the next Day . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.155) L. C. J. Was he with you there that Day you went to St. Albans ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.156) Sir Edw. Southcoat . He was with us , (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.157) I remember very particularly . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.158) It was hot Weather , (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.159) and my Lord Aston invited him into the Coach ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.160) for before he was riding by the Coach-side , (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.161) and there I remember a particular Discourse that he and my Lord Aston had ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.162) from thence we went onto Northampton , (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.163) and came there Tuesday Night . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.164) L. C. J. Was Ireland with you there ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.165) Sir Edw. Southcoat . Ireland was with us there . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.166) Oates . My Lord , I did not well observe what this Gentleman said . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.167) L. C. J. Pray mind your Business yourself , (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.168) he speaks plain enough ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.169) go on , Sir . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.170) Sir Edw. Southcoat . Mr. Ireland was with us , I say , my Lord , all the Journey ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.171) and I do remember it particularly by a pretty Horse Mr. Ireland rode upon ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.172) and I had a Dispute with my Cousin , who should buy him : (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.173) I took particular notice every Day of him , as he rode by the Coach , (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.174) and conversed with him every Night in the Inn . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.175) We went , I say , from St. Albans to Northampton on the Tuesday ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.176) from Northampton we went to Coventry on the Wednesday , and from thence to my Lord Aston 's , at Tixhall , on the Thursday . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.177) L. C. J. Come , let us go by degrees . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.178) Was Mr. Ireland with you , when you went from my Lord Aston 's at Standen to St. Albans ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.179) Sir Edw. Southcoat . Yes , he was . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.180) L. C. J. You say it was a hot Day when you set out ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.181) and my Lord Aston did invite him into the Coach . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.182) Sir Edw. Southcoat . Yes , my Lord , he came into the Coach on Monday , which was the first Day we set out , (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.183) and came that Night to St. Albans . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.184) L. C. J. You lay there that Night ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.185) --- Sir Edw. Southcoat . Yes , my Lord (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.186) L. C. J. Where did you lie there ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.187) Sir Edw. Southcoat . At the great Inn , at the Bull . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.188) L. C. J. Ay , that is the great Inn . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.189) Sir Edw. Southcoat . The next Night , my Lord , we came to Northampton . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.190) L. C. J. Where did you lie there ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.191) Sir Edw. Southcoat . We lay at the Sign of the George ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.192) it was Sir William Farmer 's House , but made use of for an Inn , because the Town was burnt down . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.193) L. C. J. Was Mr. Ireland with you all that Day ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.194) Sir Edw. Southcoat . He rode with us all the Day . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.195) L. C. J. And you took notice of it , because of his Horse , you say ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.196) Sir Edw. Southcoat . Yes , he had a very pretty Horse , my Lord ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.197) and my Brother bought the Horse of him after we came back again . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.198) L. C. J. Whither went ye the next Day ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.199) Sir Edw. Southcoat . The next Night we lay at the Bull in Coventry , (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.200) and from then on Thursday , we arrived at my Lord Aston 's at Tixhall . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.201) Mr. Att. Gen. My Lord , the Jury desires to know what he says ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.202) For they have not heard it . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.203) L. C. J. He says , Mr. Ireland went with my Lord Aston in the Coach , it being a hot Day , on Monday the 5 th of August , from Standen , my Lord Aston 's House in Hertfordshire , to St. Albans , and lay there at the Bull Inn that Night ; That he went the next Day , which was Tuesday , the 6 th of August , with them to Northampton ; That he rode upon a pretty Horse , which makes him remember it particularly , and that there was Dispute on the Road , who should buy him ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.204) and when they came back , his Brother bought him . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.205) He says , they lay on Tuesday Night at Northampton , at the George , which was a Gentleman's House , which was turned into an Inn , because of the Fire : That he went with them the next Day to Coventry , which was Wednesday the 7 th of August , and lay with them that Night at the Bull in Coventry ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.206) and the next Day , which was Thursday the 8 th , they came , and Ireland with them , to my Lord Aston 's House at Tixhall , in Staffordshire . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.207) Mr. Att. Gen. Pray Sir Edward Southcoat , how long did he stay with you at Tixhall , at my Lord Aston 's ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.208) Sir Edw. Southcoat . He staid with us there till the Tuesday after ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.209) and then we began our Journey from my Lord Aston 's House , in Tixhall , into Wales , to St. Winifred 's Well . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.210) L. C. J. That is Holy-Well , you mean . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.211) --- Sir Edw. Southcoat . Yes , my Lord . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.212) L. C. J. You say he staid all Friday , Saturday , Sunday , Monday , and till Tuesday , after you came to my Lord Aston 's at Tixhall ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.213) Sir Edw. Southcoat . Yes , my Lord , he did so . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.214) Mr. Att. Gen. So then , my Lord , we are gotten to Tuesday the 13th of August , which is past the time of the Perjury that is laid second in the Indictment ; but in point of Time , is the first that happened , (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.215) for he swore that Ireland took his leave of him , and others here in Town , between the 8 th and 12 th of August ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.216) Mr. Sol. Gen. Where did you go on Tuesday , Sir ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.217) Sir Edw. Southcoat . Towards Wales . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.218) Mr. Jones . Was he at Tixhall the 12 th of August ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.219) L. C. J. He says , he was till Tuesday the 13 th . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.220) Pray let us not have the same Questions repeated over and over again . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.221) Mr. Sol. Gen. Where did you go on Tuesday Night ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.222) Sir Edw. Southcoat . We went to Nantwich , (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.223) and lay at the Holy-Lamb there . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.224) L. C. J. Where were you the next Night ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.225) Sir Edw. Southcoat . The next Day we reached to St. Winifred 's Well . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.226) L. C. J. Where did you lie there ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.227) Sir Edw. Southcoat . At the Star , which is the great Inn there . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.228) L. C. J. It is so . (OATES-E3-P1,4,76.229) Mr. Att. Gen. Was Mr. Ireland there with you ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.231) Sir Edw. Southcoat . Yes , he was . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.232) Mr. Att. Gen. Whither did ye go then ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.233) Sir Edw. Southcoat . We staid not but one Day at Holy-Well ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.234) for we arrived there pretty late at Night , (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.235) and the Morning we spent there , (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.236) and went away in the Afternoon , (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.237) and came that Evening to Chester , (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.238) and lay there only one Night , (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.239) and came the next Day to Tixhall again . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.240) Mr. Att. Gen. Which was Friday the 16th {COM:sic_no_font_change} of August {COM:sic_no_question_mark} . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.241) Mr. Sol. Gen. Pray , My Lord , be pleased to ask him , Whether this Gentleman , Mr. Ireland , was with them all the while , in the Journey to Holy-Well ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.242) Sir Edw. Southcoat . Every Day particularly ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.243) I remember it very perfectly . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.244) Mr. Att. Gen. After he came to Tixhall again , how long did he tarry there ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.245) Sir Edw. Southcoat . That I $can $not {TEXT:cannot} so well say . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.246) I do remember truly , (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.247) but he was afterwards at my Lord Aston 's at Tixhall , (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.248) I remember some scambling Days ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.249) but I $can $not {TEXT:cannot} fix upon only two . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.250) L. C. J. Which are they ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.251) Sir Edw. Southcoat . I $can $not {TEXT:cannot} tell what Day of the Month it was , or what Day of the Week ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.252) but one Day that I remember him there , was Mr. Chetwind 's Race with Sir Henry Gough ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.253) and one other Day . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.254) L. C. J. When was that Horse-Race ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.255) --- Sir Edw. Southcoat . My Lord , I $can $not {TEXT:cannot} tell what Day of the Month it was . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.256) Mr. Att. Gen. When was the other time you speak of ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.257) Sir Edw. Southcoat . I remember him there one Thursday upon the Bowling-Green at Tixhall , where there was a particular Company . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.258) Mr. Sol. Gen. My Lord , we desire to know , when his Brother did buy the Horse of Mr. Ireland ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.259) Sir Edw. Southcoat . When we came back ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.260) for he came home with us from my Lord Aston 's (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.261) and we began our Journey , the 9 th or th of September , from Tixhall to Kingston ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.262) and when we arriv'd at my Father's House , my Brother bought the Horse of him . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.263) L. C. J. Did you come home back again with Mr. Ireland , so you say ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.264) Sir Edw. Southcoat . Yes , my Lord , we did . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.265) L. C. J. When did you set out from Tixhall ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.266) Sir Edw. Southcoat . The ninth of September , my Lord , I think it was ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.267) I am sure it was upon a Monday , the 9 th or th . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.268) L. C. J. When did you come home ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.269) Sir Edw. Southcoat . We were four Days on our Journey . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.270) L. C. J. And did you come straight to London ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.271) Sir Edw. Southcoat . No , we went to my Father's House in Surrey . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.272) L. C. J. Which way did you come ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.273) Sir Edw. Southcoat . The first Night we came to the Bull in Coventry ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.274) and from thence , the next Night , we went to the Altar-Stone at Banbury ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.275) and from Banbury , we came the third Day to Agmondesham I think it is called a little Town in Buckinghamshire ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.276) and from thence the fourth Day , to my Father's House , by Kingston in Surrey . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.277) Mr. Att. Gen. And then Ireland sold his Brother his Horse . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.278) L. C. J. How long was he at your Father's House in Surrey , Sir Edward ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.279) Sir Edw. Southcoat . My Lord , we came on the Thursday ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.280) and as I take it , he went on the Saturday to London . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.281) My Brother , after he had bought his Horse , lent him the Horse to Town ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.282) and sent a Man with him to bring it back again . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.283) Mr. Att. Gen. That Saturday , my Lord , makes it come just to the Fourteenth of September ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.284) and is the very Day Fortnight before Michaelmas-Day . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.285) Oates . My Lord , I desire to ask this Gentleman , whether he saw Ireland all August , and till the Fourteenth of September in Staffordshire , and elsewhere ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.286) And how long in Staffordshire ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.287) Sir Edw. Southcoat . I $can $not {TEXT:cannot} say as to any particular Days of the Month , after our coming from Holy-Well , till our coming from Tixhall to London . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.288) L. C. J. Marry , if he did , he would contradict what he had said before : (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.289) For , from the time of coming from Holy-Well , till the time of coming back to London , he could tell but of two Days , and those uncertain : (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.290) For he remembers not by the Times , but by other particular Circumstances . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.291) Oates . Pray , my Lord , be pleased to ask him this Question , (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.292) When was the first Day he saw him in September ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.293) Sir Edw. Southcoat . Truly , my Lord , I remember not any Day before we began our Journey home . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.294) Mr. Att. Gen. But , my Lord , this is his Testimony : (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.295) He was in his Company till the sixteenth of August . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.296) It is true , there were other times that he saw him at Tixhall ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.297) but he $can $not {TEXT:cannot} particularly speak unto them : (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.298) But , by and by , we shall go on to every Day , and prove particularly where he was . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.299) Oates . My Lord , I desire to know , Was Sir Edw. Southcoat at the Trial of Ireland a Witness , or no ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.300) --- Sir Edw. Southcoat . No , I was not , my Lord . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.301) Oates . Were you at Whitebread 's Trial , Sir ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.302) Sir Edw. Southcoat . Yes , I was , (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.303) and gave the same Evidence I give now . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.304) Mr. Sol. Gen. Then swear Mr. John Southcoat . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.305) Which was done . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.306) Mr. Att. Gen. This is Sir Edward Southcoat 's Brother , my Lord . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.307) L. C. J. What , he that bought the Horse ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.308) Mr. John Southcoat . Yes , my Lord , I bought the Horse of Mr. Ireland . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.309) L. C. J. Well , what do you ask him ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.310) --- Mr. Att. Gen. Pray , Sir , When did you meet Mr. Ireland in August 1678 ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.311) And where ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.312) Mr. John Southcoat . My Lord , I met with Mr. Ireland , upon Monday the Fifth of August , at the Bull -Inn in St. Albans , with my Lord Aston : (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.313) I came thither that day with my Father and Mother . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.314) And the next Day we went to Northampton ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.315) and there we inn'd at the Sign of the George , Sir William Farmer 's House , which is an House in the Road , us'd for an Inn since the Town was burnt : (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.316) And I conversed with him every day , in our Journey . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.317) And from thence , the next day , we went to Coventry , to the Bull -Inn there ; and from thence , to my Lord Aston 's on Thursday Night at Tixhall : (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.318) There we staid all Friday , Saturday , Sunday , and Monday . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.319) Mr. Ireland was there ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.320) I was with him all the while . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.321) And then upon Tuesday we set out for Holy-Well in Flintshire , (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.322) and went that Night to Nantwich to the Lamb there . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.323) And the next day we went through Chester to Holy-Well : (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.324) We staid that Night at Holy-Well ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.325) and the next day came back again towards Noon to Chester ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.326) and there lay that Night : (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.327) And then the next Night , which was Friday , we came back again to Tixhall . (OATES-E3-P1,4,77.328) L. C. J. Was Mr. Ireland with you both those Journeys , all the while ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.330) Mr. John Southcoat . Yes , my Lord , he was ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.331) I did see him , (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.332) and rode with him every Day . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.333) L. C. J. Pray , Sir , how long were you at Tixhall , after you came from Holy Well ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.334) Mr. John Southcoat . We staid there till we came away for good and all . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.335) L. C. J. Was Mr. Ireland with you all that time ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.336) Mr. John Southcoat . No , he was not . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.337) Mr. Att. Gen. Do you remember , that Mr. Ireland came to Tixhall the Ninth of September ; and came along home with you , when you came ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.338) Mr. John Southcoat . Yes , I remember it very well . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.339) L. C. J. What Day did you come home , Sir ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.340) Mr. John Southcoat . We came home in four Days . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.341) Mr. Sol. Gen. When did he leave you ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.342) --- Mr. John Southcoat . We came home upon Thursday , (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.343) and he went to London on Saturday . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.344) L. C. J. Pray , Sir , can you recollect when you did first see him again at Tixhall , after you came from Holy-Well ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.345) --- Mr. John Southcoat . My Lord , I $can $not {TEXT:cannot} tell particularly any Day , till the Day we came away . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.346) L. C. J. Do you remember the Horse-Match between Mr. Chetwind and Sir Henry Gough ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.347) --- Mr. John Southcoat . I was there , my Lord ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.348) but I do not remember Mr. Ireland was there . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.349) L. C. J. How long did he stay at your Father's House in Surrey , Sir ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.350) Mr. John Southcoat . Two Days , my Lord . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.351) Mr. Sol. Gen. You lent him your Horse you bought of him , I think Sir ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.352) Mr. John Southcoat . Yes , up to London , I did ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.353) and I sent my Man with him , to bring him back again . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.354) Mr. Att. Gen. Has Mr. Oates any Questions to ask this Gentleman ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.355) Oates . My Lord , I desire to ask Mr. Southcoat , Whether or no he is sure , that Ireland was in his Company from the fifth of August to the Sixteenth ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.356) Mr. John Southcoat . Yes , every day , I am sure of it ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.357) I remember it very well . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.358) Oates . Pray , my Lord , ask him , Whether or no he testified this that he now swears at Ireland 's Trial ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.359) Mr. John Southcoat . My Lord , I was not at Ireland 's Trial . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.360) Oates . Then I desire to ask him , Whether or no he did testify this at the five Jesuits Trial ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.361) Mr. John Southcoat . No , I was not sent for to any of the Trials . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.362) L. C. J. I am sorry you were not , Sir : (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.363) $'T $was {TEXT:'Twas} pity you were not there . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.364) It might have saved some innocent Blood . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.365) Mr. Att. Gen. Now swear Harrison . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.366) Which was done . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.367) Mr. Sol. Gen. Pray , will you give an Account when you saw Ireland , and where ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.368) Harrison . In the Year of our Lord 1678 , my Master , Sir John Southcoat , went with my Lady , on Monday the Fifth of August , to St. Albans ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.369) and we came with a Coach and four Horses : (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.370) For my Master had an old Servant , that had a Pair of Horses , which my Master made use of . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.371) And there we met my Lord Aston , in the Company of Mr. Ireland . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.372) And the next Morning , my Lord Aston went with my Master and Lady towards Tixhall : (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.373) And I rode by , in Mr. Ireland 's Company ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.374) and came $acquainted {TEXT:ac_uainted} with him that Day . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.375) That Night we came to Northampton ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.376) and there we inn'd at a Stone-House , that was used for the Inn , the Town being burnt before . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.377) The next Night we went to Coventry ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.378) and on Thursday we came to Tixhall : (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.379) There we staid till Tuesday . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.380) After we went to Holy-Well ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.381) and the Tuesday Night we lay at Nantwich : (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.382) And thence we went to Holy-Well , (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.383) and staid there on Wednesday Night : (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.384) And on Thursday we came to West-Chester ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.385) and I parted with him upon the Friday at West-Chester . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.386) Mr. Att. Gen. Pray , did you know this Ireland ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.387) Was it he that was tried and executed ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.388) --- Harrison . I was at Mr. Ireland 's Trial . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.389) L. C. J. Was it the same Man that was tried ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.390) Harrison . My Lord , I saw him at his Trial , (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.391) the Hair of his Face was grown , (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.392) and he was a little disordered ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.393) he did not look so well , because he was not so well dress'd ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.394) but it was the same Man , my Lord . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.395) Mr. Sol. Gen. Before this Man goes , we have more Questions to ask him : (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.396) When did you see him again , (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.397) after you left him in Chester , you say ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.398) Harrison . I saw him several times at Tixhall ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.399) I saw him at the Bowling-green upon Thursday ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.400) and I saw him when the Horse-Race was between Mr. Chetwind and Sir Henry Gough : (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.401) I $can $not {TEXT:cannot} tell what Day it was ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.402) for I had no reason to keep an account of the particular Days at that time . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.403) Mr. Att. Gen. Did you come up with your Master again the 9th of September ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.404) Harrison . My Lord , I did so ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.405) I have a Note wherein I set down the Charges at that time . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.406) It is in this bit of Paper , which I have kept in my Almanack ever since . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.407) My Lord Aston sent his Coach with us to Banbury , where my Master's Coach was to meet him ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.408) but came only to Coventry the first Night . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.409) The next Night , which was Tuesday , we came to the Altar-Stone at Banbury , (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.410) and there we lay : (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.411) From thence , on Wednesday , we came to Agmondesham , where we were ill lodged . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.412) The next Day we baited at Uxbridge , (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.413) and came to Kingston , and so to Sir John Southcoat 's House upon the Thursday Night . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.414) Upon the Friday Mr. Ireland sold his Horse to Mr. John Southcoat , my Master's Son . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.415) Upon the Saturday Morning , I came with him from my Master's House towards London ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.416) he did ride upon the Horse he had sold to Mr. Southcoat , (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.417) and so we came up to Town , (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.418) and took water ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.419) and I took a little Bag that belonged to Mr. Ireland upon my Arm , (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.420) and we landed at Somerset-House , (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.421) and I came with him to his Lodging in Russel-Street ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.422) and when he came there , he went up stairs , where two Women met him , and welcom'd him home : (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.423) Said they , We are glad you are come , (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.424) we thought we had lost you , because we had never heard from you all this while . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.425) There I took my leave of him , (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.426) and did not see him again till his Trial at the Old-Bailey ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.427) and this was Saturday the 14th of September . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.428) L. C. J. Pray let me see your Paper you speak of . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.429) Which was delivered in , (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.430) and the Court look'd upon it . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.431) L. C. J. Did you write this in your Journey ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.432) Harrison . Yes , my Lord , I did it at that time . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.433) Mr. Att. Gen. Are the particular Days inserted there , my Lord ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.434) L. C. J. No , they are not , Mr. Attorney . (OATES-E3-P1,4,78.435) Harrison . I could not write well ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.437) it was only but Memorandums for myself . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.438) L. C. J. What Day of the Month was the Saturday he came to Town ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.439) Harrison . It was the 14th of September , my Lord . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.440) L. C. J. That agrees with all that the Women said , that he came on Saturday , a Fortnight before Michaelmas , being the same Day of the Week as Michaelmas-day was : (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.441) Thus far it is as clear as the Sun at Noon-day . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.442) Oates . My Lord , there was a time when this was not believed . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.443) L. C. J. Ay , Mr. Oates , we know there was a time , when there were Ignoramus Juries , and things were believed , and not believed , as the Humour went . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.444) What can you , Mr. Oates , say to it ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.445) I must needs tell you , prima facie , $'t $is {TEXT:'tis} so strong an Evidence , that if you have any Sense in the World you must be concerned at it . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.446) Oates . Not at all , my Lord , I know who they are , and what is the end of it all . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.447) L. C. J. Upon my Faith , I have so much Charity for you , as my Fellow-Creature , as to be concerned for you . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.448) Oates . $'T $is {TEXT:'Tis} not two Straws matter whether you be or no ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.449) I know my own Innocency . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.450) L. C. J. Thou art the most obstinately hardened Wretch that ever I saw . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.451) Oates . Pray , my Lord , ask him , Whether he did not appear to Mr. Ireland 's Trial ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.452) And let it be remember'd what Credit he had then for all this Story he tells now . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.453) These People come here to serve a turn only , (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.454) and care not what they swear against me . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.455) L. C. J. You must hold your tongue . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.456) Oates . My Lord , I must speak the Truth , (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.457) and I will speak the Truth . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.458) L. C. J. I think there is scarce a Word of Truth comes out of thy Mouth . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.459) Oates . You may think what you will , my Lord ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.460) but these Popish Traitors , I am sure will swear any thing , and suborn Witnesses upon Witnesses against me to overthrow the Plot . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.461) Mr. Just. Withins . If you $can $not {TEXT:cannot} behave yourself better than you do , we must send you elsewhere ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.462) we must not suffer this Behaviour : (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.463) And therefore either be quiet , (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.464) or get you gone . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.465) L. $C. $J. {TEXT:L.J.C.} Let him keep himself in order , (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.466) and $we $'ll {TEXT:we'll} hear him . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.467) If he thinks by boisterous Impudency to outface Justice , we will not suffer it . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.468) Go on , Mr. Attorney . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.469) Mr. Att. Gen. Swear Mr. George Hobson . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.470) Which was done . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.471) Mr. Sol. Gen. Were you in the Journey to Tixhall with Mr. Ireland , and my Lord Aston in 78 ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.472) Mr. Hobson . Yes , I was so , my Lord . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.473) Mr. Sol. Gen. Pray tell all your Knowledge of the matter . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.474) Mr. Hobson . From the 3d of August till the 15th at Night , I was present with him every Day . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.475) L. C. J. How do you know you were ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.476) Mr. Hobson . That is to say , the 3d of August he came to my Lord's House at Standen , in Hertfordshire , in the Evening , (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.477) and there he remained till Monday the 5th of August ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.478) and that Day in the Morning he went , together with other Company to St. Albans , where we met Sir John Southcoat and his Lady towards the Evening ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.479) and we all lodged there , because that was the appointed Place to meet at : (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.480) We lodged the 6th of August at Night at Northampton ; upon the 7th at Coventry ; upon the 8th at Tixhall , my Lord's House , where Mr. Ireland remained till Tuesday the 13th in the Morning . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.481) And upon the 13th in the Morning we set forth with my Lady Aston , my Lord's Mother , Sir John Southcoat , and Mr. Ireland , and the other Company , towards a Place called Holy-Well , where Mr. Ireland was with the rest of the Company ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.482) and on Thursday Night we returned back again to Chester , (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.483) and lay there . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.484) Upon Friday we came back again to my Lord's House at Tixhall . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.485) After that I did not see Mr. Ireland till Monday the 25th of August , when he came back again to our House : (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.486) Where he went in the mean time I $can $not {TEXT:cannot} tell . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.487) L. C. J. Whose House is it that this Man means by our House ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.488) Mr. Hobson . I mean my Lord Aston 's House , at Tixhall . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.489) L. C. J. You know him very well , did not you ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.490) Mr. Hobson . Yes , my Lord , I knew him very well . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.491) L. C. J. You say , he came back the 26th of August to Tixhall ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.492) Mr. Hobson . Yes , as I remember , he did so . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.493) Mr. Att. Gen. How long after the 26th of August was it , that you saw him at Tixhall ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.494) Mr. Hobson . When he went away for London . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.495) Mr. Att. Gen. When was that ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.496) --- Mr. Hobson . The 9th of September . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.497) L. C. J. Did you come along with him to London ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.498) Mr. Hobson . No , my Lord ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.499) I saw him go ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.500) he was not in the Coach , (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.501) but he was in the Company . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.502) Oates . My Lord , I would fain ask him a Question , When he was first acquainted with Mr. Ireland , that he speaks of ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.503) Mr. Hobson . I never saw him till he came to my Lord Aston 's , at Standen . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.504) Oates . Were you at the Trial of Mr. Ireland , Sir ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.505) Mr. Hobson . No , my Lord , I was not ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.506) I was then in Staffordshire . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.507) Oates . Then it is material , my Lord , for me to ask him this Question , it relating to a particular Person ; Whether Ireland that was executed , was the Ireland he says he was with ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.508) L. C. J. I will ask him , if you will . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.509) Was that the same Man that was afterwards tried and executed . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.510) Mr. Hobson . I believe it was , my Lord . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.511) Oates . I insist not so much upon the Question , but only in reference to the Witness , his Acquaintance being so short with him . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.512) L. C. J. Truly , I think it is not so very short ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.513) for he swears he was with him from the 3d of August till the 16th every Day . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.514) Mr. Just. Withins . I have no great Acquaintance with you ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.515) but I know you , Mr. Oates , because I have seen you so often . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.516) L. C. J. Is it the same Ireland that was at the Trial ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.517) You , Harrison , you saw him then ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.518) Harrison . The very same , and no other . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.519) Mr. Just. Withins . Certainly no body doubts that . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.520) L. C. J. $'T $is {TEXT:'Tis} fit he should have this Question answer'd , if the Witness can . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.521) Pray , go on , Mr. Attorney . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.522) Mr. Att. Gen. Swear George North . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.523) Which was done . (OATES-E3-P1,4,79.524) Pray , will you give an account where you met Mr. Ireland , and whether you was with him in his Journey ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.525) North . My Lord , I saw him the 4th of August , which was Sunday , at Standen , my Lord Aston 's House , in Hertfordshire : (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.526) Upon the 5th he went with my Lord to St. Albans ; where my Lord met with Sir John Southcoat and his Lady ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.527) and I was with them . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.528) And from thence we went on Tuesday to the George at Northampton : And from thence , on Wednesday the 7th , to the Bull at Coventry : (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.529) And upon the 8th , we came to Tixhall , which was Thursday . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.530) And from Thursday the 8th , to Tuesday the 13th , I did see him every day at my Lord's House at Tixhall . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.531) L. C. J. Whither went he then ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.532) North . He went with my old Lady , and some other Company , to go to Holy-Well . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.533) L. C. J. When did you see him again ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.534) North . I did see him several times after that at Tixhall : (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.535) But I took not particular notice of him again till he went away for London . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.536) L. C. J. When was that ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.537) North . I did see him the 9th of September . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.538) He came to go with Sir John Southcoat to London : Mr. John Southcoat , and he . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.539) I took my leave of him . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.540) Oates . What Religion are you of , Sir ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.541) North . I am a Catholick , my Lord . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.542) Oates . I desire to know , how he comes to remember this so well ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.543) North . I waited at the Table ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.544) and he was every day at Dinner with my Lord . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.545) Oates . Were you at the Trial of Ireland a Witness ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.546) North . No indeed , my Lord , I was not . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.547) Mr. Att. Gen. Swear Richard Ingletrap . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.548) Which was done . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.549) Mr. Sol. Gen. Pray , will you give an acconnt {COM:sic} , whether you knew Mr. Ireland , and where you saw him ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.550) Ingletrap . The 1st of August , my Lord , I was ordered to be at Standen in Hertfordshire , to wait upon my Lord Aston , to go with him to Tixhall . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.551) And the 3d of August I saw Mr. Ireland there at Standen Lodge at my Lord's House . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.552) The 4th Day he rested there , being Sabbath-day . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.553) Mr. Att. Gen. What are you , an Hackney-Coachman ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.554) Ingletrap . Yes , my Lord , I am so . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.555) And upon the 5th , which was Monday , he went with my Lord Aston to St. Albans ; upon the 6th to Northampton ; on the 7th , to Coventry ; and the 8th Day , to Tixhall Lodge . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.556) He was in the Company , (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.557) and went all the way with him ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.558) and I was there too . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.559) L. C. J. How long did he stay there ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.560) --- Ingletrap . Till Tuesday the 13th . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.561) L. C. J. Did you see him there till Tuesday ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.562) Ingletrap . I do not say , that I did see him every Day . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.563) L. C. J. Did you go with them on Tuesday to Holy-Well ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.564) Ingletrap . No , I did not . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.565) Mr. Att. Gen. But , my Lord , you observe , that is past one of the Times that he swore Ireland was here in Town ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.566) that is between the 8th and 12th of August . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.567) L. C. J. It is so . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.568) Mr. Att. Gen. Pray , what Religion are you of , Mr. Ingletrap ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.569) Ingletrap . I am a Protestant , my Lord . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.570) Oates . Were you at the Trial of the five Jesuits , or that of Ireland ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.571) Ingletrap . No , I was not . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.572) Oates . My Lord , I desire you would ask him , he being a Protestant , how he came to be acquainted with Ireland , that was a Priest ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.573) L. C. J. Why , Mr. Oates , is there no Conversation to be between Papists and Protestants ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.574) Oates . Truly , very little , my Lord : (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.575) But that is not the Point now , (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.576) I desire to have an Answer to my Question . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.577) Ingletrap . There was no great Acquaintance between us , my Lord ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.578) for I never saw him before that time . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.579) Mr. Att. Gen. Swear Andrew Wetton . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.580) Which was done . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.581) Did you go that Journey with my Lord Aston to Tixhall ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.582) Wetton . No ; I went from Tixhall to Holy-well . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.583) Mr. Att. Gen. What Day did you set out from Tixhall ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.584) Wetton . Upon Tuesday the 13th of August . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.585) Mr. Sol. Gen. Where did you lie that Night ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.586) Wetton . At Nantwich at the Holy-Lamb . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.587) And next Day we baited at Chester ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.588) and from thence we came the next Night to Holy-Well . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.589) There we staid all Night , and till next day at Noon . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.590) We din'd at Holy-Well , (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.591) and came that Night back to Chester . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.592) And from thence , the next day , we came home to Tixhall . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.593) L. C. J. Was Mr. Ireland there all the while ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.594) Wetton . Mr. Ireland was there , (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.595) I looked after his Horse . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.596) L. C. J. When did he come first to Tixhall ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.597) Wetton . He came upon the 8th , (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.598) and staid till the 13th ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.599) and then went to Holy-Well . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.600) Mr. Sol. Gen. Pray , what Religion are you of ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.601) Wetton . I am Protestant , Sir . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.602) Mr. Att. Gen. And the 9th of September he came away from Tixhall to London , you say ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.603) Wetton . Yes ; I saw them take Coach ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.604) and he did ride on horseback . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.605) L. C. J. Did you see him often at Tixhall , between the time he came from Holy-Well and the time he went to London ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.606) Wetton . Yes , he was there several times ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.607) but I $can $not {TEXT:cannot} tell the particular Days : (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.608) But , my Lord , if you please , I can tell you the very Money he gave me , which was a Shilling and two Sixpences , when he came back from Holy-Well . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.609) L. C. J. And the 16th , you say , he came back from Holy-Well ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.610) Wetton . Yes , it was the 16th , upon Friday , that he came from Holy-Well . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.611) L. C. J. And he says , the 9th of September he came back again from Tixhall to London ; and that he saw him several times , in the mean time , at my Lord Aston 's House . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.612) Mr. Sol. Gen. So , my Lord , we are past one of the times ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.613) and have fix'd him at Tixhall upon the 16th . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.614) Mr. Att. Gen. We have a Couple of Witnesses more upon this Point , (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.615) and then we shall go on to the 17th ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.616) and so all along to the 9th of September . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.617) Mr. Att. Gen. Swear Thomas Sawyer . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.618) Which was done . (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.619) When came Mr. Ireland to Tixhall ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.620) can you tell ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.621) --- Mr. Sawyer . He came the 8th of August to Tixhall , (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.622) and continued there till the 13th : (OATES-E3-P1,4,80.623) And then he went away ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.624) but whither he went I $can $not {TEXT:cannot} tell : (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.625) But , as I was told , it was to Holy-Well . (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.626) Mr. Att. Gen. When did he come to Tixhall again ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.627) Mr. Sawyer . When my old Lady Aston came home , which was Friday the 16th . (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.628) Mr. Sol. Gen. Do you know when he left Tixhall for good and all ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.629) Mr. Sawyer . The 9th of September , my Lord , he went with Sir John Southcoat to go to London . (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.630) L. C. J. Can you remember {COM:sic} he was there at any time between the 16th of August , and the 9th of September ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.631) Mr. Sawyer . He was once or twice there ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.632) but I $can $not {TEXT:cannot} tell the particular Days . (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.633) Mr. Sol. Gen. What Persuasion are you of , as to Religion , Sir ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.634) Mr. Sawyer . I am one of the Church of England , my Lord . (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.635) L. C. J. Truth is the same in all Persuasions . (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.636) Mr. Sol. Gen. But we would obviate Mr. Oates 's Objection that they are all Papists . (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.637) Mr. Att. Gen. Swear Frances Allen . (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.638) Which was done . (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.639) Pray , will you give an Account , when you saw Mr. Ireland in Staffordshire ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.640) Mrs. Allen . He came the 8th Day of August to Tixhall , (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.641) and continued there the 9th , , 11th , 12th , and to the 13th in the Morning , (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.642) and then he did go to Holy-Well . (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.643) Mr. Att. Gen. She will tell you of one particular Circumstance , how she remembers him about that Time . (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.644) Mrs. Allen . The of August was Saturday ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.645) and that which causeth me to remember it , is this : (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.646) There was a Woman , one Sarah Paine , I think her Name was , which testified at the Trial , that he was in Town at that Time ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.647) but he was not : (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.648) For he was at Tixhall upon the , which was Saturday ; and the 11th , which was Sabbath-day : (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.649) And I saw him in the Chamber those Days . (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.650) Mr. Att. Gen. How came you to know him so well ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.651) Mrs. Allen . I was a Servant to my Lord Aston , (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.652) and look'd to Mr. Ireland 's Chamber , (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.653) and wash'd his Linnen ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.654) and those Days I saw him in his Chamber . (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.655) Mr. Att. Gen. When he went from Tixhall to Holy-Well the 13th , when did he come back again ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.656) --- Mrs. Allen . The 16th Day , which was Friday . (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.657) Mr. Att. Gen. Did he come afterwards to Tixhall at any Time ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.658) Mrs. Allen . He went away the 17th , (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.659) and I can tell you by a good Token , that he did so : (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.660) For the 17th I carried his Clothes into his Chamber , that he was to take with him . (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.661) Mr. Att. Gen. When did he come again to Tixhall ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.662) Mrs. Allen . He came several Times , (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.663) but truly I $can $not {TEXT:cannot} tell what Days particularly . (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.664) --- Mr. Sol. Gen. Pray when did he go away for good and all ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.665) Mrs. Allen . I remember his going away with Sir John Southcoat , (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.666) but I $can $not {TEXT:cannot} tell the Time . (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.667) Mr. Att. Gen. Pray , what Religion are you of ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.668) Mrs. Allen . I am a Protestant of the Church of England ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.669) so I was christened , (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.670) so I have lived , (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.671) and so I hope to die before you all . (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.672) L. C. J. Upon my word , she is very kind , (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.673) she has a Mind to die before us : (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.674) $'T $is {TEXT:'Tis} a Sign she lives a good Life , $she $'s {TEXT:she's} so ready to die . (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.675) Mr. Att. Gen. So , my Lord , you see , that the 17th of August he departed from my Lord Aston 's . (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.676) Now we shall call Mrs. Harwell to give you an Account whither he went on the 17th . (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.677) Swear Mrs. Jane Harwell . (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.678) Which was done . (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.679) Mr. Sol. Gen. Where do you live , Mrs. Harwell ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.680) Mrs. Harwell . I live now in Town , my Lord . (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.681) Mr. Sol. Gen. Where did you live in the Year 78 ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.682) Mrs. Harwell . At Wolverhampton . (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.683) Mr. Sol. Gen. Did you know Mr. Ireland , (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.684) he that was executed ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.685) Mrs. Harwell . Very well , my Lord . (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.686) Mr. Sol. Gen. What Time did he come to your House at Wolverhampton ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.687) Mrs. Harwell . The 17th of August , 1678 . (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.688) Mr. Sol. Gen. What Day of the Week was it ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.689) Mrs. Harwell . Upon Saturday . (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.690) Mr. Sol. Gen. From whence did he say he came at that Time ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.691) Mrs. Harwell . I do verily believe it was from Tixhall that he came ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.692) I $can $not {TEXT:cannot} positively say . (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.693) Mr. Sol. Gen. How long staid he there ? (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.694) Mrs. Harwell . He came to my House the 17th of August , 1678 . (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.695) He supped there that Night , (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.696) and I think he lay in my House every Night till the 26th of the same Month . (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.697) Upon the 19th Day , after Dinner , I went with him a good Part of the Town of Wolverhampton ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.698) and upon Friday following , which was the 23d , he went a little Way out of Town , to a Fair hard by , (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.699) and return'd the same Day , (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.700) and staid at my House the next Day , being Bartholomew-Day . (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.701) The next Day , being the 25th , being Sunday , he was at my House , (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.702) and he staid , as I said , every Night , (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.703) and lay at my House ; (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.704) and went away on Monday the 26th of August . (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.705) It was , to the best of my Remembrance , in the Morning . (OATES-E3-P1,4,81.706)